Oral History Interview with James Robert Snyder

Glen Taul

And then we'll get we'll get into now. See, when did you--when did you come to Georgetown? I mean, when you start school?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, my family actually came in 1948. And when I was a junior in high school. Because my father became the registrar and director of admissions, he spent most of his time at admissions. And then, I graduated from high school here, in 1950. So, I started college in the fall of '51.

Glen Taul

Okay, so did you live on campus or off?

J. Robert Snyder

No--we lived at home. In fact my parents kept boarders--kept students as boarders upstairs.

Glen Taul

Oh, that right?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Now, where was that?

J. Robert Snyder

At the end of Military Street, just to the south.

Glen Taul

To the south? Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

--A lot of people in this neighborhood kept students.

Glen Taul

Did the most of the professor's back then have--had kidd at college age do that also?

J. Robert Snyder

Not very many. No, I think. No, it was not nor--of course, we had to stop it. Because the college built the dormitories for students.

Glen Taul

So, they were--

J. Robert Snyder

--Particularly male students.

Glen Taul

Okay, so they were requiring even employees and professors who had children that were going to Georgetown to require them to live in the dormitories after that was done?

J. Robert Snyder

In the late 50s. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay. Okay, what's the first impressions that---of course, you had some early impressions about Georgetown, how were they different when you started college as opposed to--of growing up or being exposed to it your high school days?

J. Robert Snyder

I don't remember any different, it was a natural progression for me because, you know, we'd been around the college. My parents, both my parents are graduates here.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And we just went from one building to another. And I knew most of the faculty members anyway, because most of them, most of the faculties were members of the same church.

Glen Taul

What church was that?

J. Robert Snyder

The Georgetown Baptist--

Glen Taul

Georgetown Baptist Church. That church is sort of seen as the college church, isn't it?

J. Robert Snyder

It was for, maybe 150 years. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Yeah. What do you remember about your first class as a freshman?

J. Robert Snyder

Most of my classes were in the John L. Hill Chapel, where the building had been modified in the process, to include classrooms in the basement, that was not in the original design. And offices, in fact, the president's and the Dean's office, we're in the rear of that building. Most of that--what was given over to a variety of offices and classrooms, but I think I had most of my classes there in that building.

Glen Taul

Okay. What was the most--what was your--what was your impressions as a freshman?

J. Robert Snyder

Well as a freshman, it was a strange combination. We would I mean, if kids look back now, they would find it rather strange because it was conservative in a lot of ways, but yet fairly liberal in other ways. And it was reflecting the return of the veterans from the Second World War. Some of them still here. We--the college had just gotten into an expanded athletic program, we had a real fine football program, basketball, all that. No, no girls programs to speak of. But, the girls were mostly in one building called Rucker Hall.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And there, they had rather strict rules, on sign out and signing in and dates. And men can only be in the lobbies areas--the of parlors they called them, at certain times. And they built an addition onto it while I was here, called Bristow Hall (??)--just an--extended one wing. And the bottom part of that became the cafeteria, they didn't have a cafeteria, I guess when I came--.

Glen Taul

Oh, is that right?

J. Robert Snyder

--So they built that, the cafeteria was the lower part. And they brought--brought in a barracks building from an atomic energy plant. South of us here, in Tennessee. That was the bookstore. It was over here--between the chapel and Giddings.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

It was a bookstore sort of--and grill and it was in this army building.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

They had a bunch of army buildings. Actually, there was a----the whole biology, science, some of the music stuff was in a building--in the north west corner of the campus in that low place now, where the--?

Glen Taul

Theater's located.

J. Robert Snyder

Theater's located. Yeah, that was big a army. And the whole series of barracks up here where the maintenance shops are.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Gosh, there were five or six of them--

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

--They had big barracks out there. And trailers about a--nice 40 or 50 trailers.

Glen Taul

Goodness gracious.

J. Robert Snyder

In rows--for married students. The college, it never had anything like that before, married students with families.

Glen Taul

That was a new phenomenon with, I guess the veterans coming back and they were getting married right after the war and--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--The GI Bill was paying their way through college.

J. Robert Snyder

Right. And it was a lot of older ministerial students, too, I think, mixed in that too.

Glen Taul

Now, where did they come from?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, Georgetown was the primary training ground for ministers in Kentucky and southern Ohio. And gosh, we may have had 20 or 30 graduate a year, going into the ministry. And it's reflected now in the officials of the Kentucky Baptist Convention. You know, here we are 50 years later. They--just can come from all walks of life. And that's true. But all colleges had the same problem. With that GI Bill--really was the main impetus.

Glen Taul

It flooded the campuses with--.

J. Robert Snyder

All and--you had to get trailers and buildings.

Glen Taul

Now, is it your impression that at the beginning of your freshman year, that was one of the highest enrollments, up to that time?

J. Robert Snyder

1950-1951? Probably, I've been told 1946 was a real boom year, because of the--the veterans suddenly showed up and there wasn't anything for them. There were no rooms, dorms anything like that. And a lot of them were housed in the gymnasium, I understand.

Glen Taul

Oh, they were?

J. Robert Snyder

At the gym, yeah. So that was a sudden change. Maybe a third increase in one fall.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

I don't remember any sudden increases. And of course, we went into the Korean War in the middle of that, before I graduated, and then they were all in a--sort of was stable. I don't remember a lot of people being drafted out of school, but we were eligible for it that way.

Glen Taul

What--now the curriculum that you took, had you anticipated going into political science or to teaching when you came--when you entered Georgetown?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, I knew what I enjoyed doing and I just took what I enjoyed, I didn't really worry about you know, how it fitted in any pattern or anything. I'd always liked history and political science, government. My father had been in the government at Frankfort. We came from Frankfort here, actually.

Glen Taul

Oh, okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And then I enjoyed physics and math, too. So I just--and we had a--single teachers in the subjects too. We don't have that. S--one teacher might be the whole department.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

In math and in physics, it was that way. So I just took what I enjoyed, and I just, I didn't really worry about it.

Glen Taul

So the faculty was rather limited? In those days?

J. Robert Snyder

It was a small faculty.

Glen Taul

A small.

J. Robert Snyder

Maybe 30.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Well, who were some of the more outstanding, in your mind, Faculty?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, we didn't really have anybody in political science, they sort of farmed that around. --But Dr. Carl Fields was the head of the history department and Horace Hambrick. In--in math, I really enjoyed math a good bit, it was about the most challenging thing I think I've ever done is. And Charles Hatfield was the--he was the only teacher. And he'd been done that for 30 or 40 years when--I came. He actually had memorized the textbooks, you didn't have--you just had to tell him a number and he'd go run it out. [clears throat]

Glen Taul

Goodness.

J. Robert Snyder

In all kinds of math and geometry and trigonometry and all that stuff, calculus. And Dr. H.Y. Mullikan (??) was the physics teacher. He was in the basement of Giddings Hall. That was all physics down there, and he was an interesting teacher. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Why were they Interesting?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, he could project--Dr. Hatfield, the challenge was there every day, you know, it was all memorizing how to, to do math of every kind and it got more complicated as you got into calculus and advancement, stuff like that. And physics, you were just sort of exploring the world. I've never really forgotten. Now--part of my introduction to nuclear physics, which, when I wrote my dissertation, on sharing the atom, which involved some of that.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

So it all fit--fitted together, as I look back. I just did what I enjoyed doing, but it all fitted together.

Glen Taul

So, they didn't have a set curriculum back in those days?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh---yeah. It was, it has been cut back some, but generally, the first two years were all required courses.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

All required courses, yeah.

Glen Taul

Just to make sure you got a variety or breadth of knowledge?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, it was based on I think, what the American clleges and universities in general did in the 30s and 40s.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Some of the things they did then, we don't do now. That--they had required two years in foreign language, for example, we don't do that quite--we're just nine now--.

Glen Taul

Oh.

J. Robert Snyder

--But it was 12 hours and it was a required course in history, everybody took six hours of history. Let's see, English is about the same--didn't, we did not require philosophy or public speaking like we do now. So, what--ours today is probably a little bit more balanced too, yeah.

Glen Taul

More balanced in the 50s, you think?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah--because, like I said, the basic root of all of college education is really philosophy. And when that was not required---in fact, we didn't teach a whole lot of philosophy.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And it was--it was part of the religion, part of the Bible department--.

Glen Taul

The Bi---oh, they call it the Bible department.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah--some--one of them taught philosophy. That's all we had, yeah.

Glen Taul

Now, who was in--who was in the Bible department?

J. Robert Snyder

Dr. George Redding was doing it by himself.

Glen Taul

Oh, he was.

J. Robert Snyder

And then Dr. Dailey (??) came in, he taught Old Testament and philosophy.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

He later became the editor of The Western Recorder.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

For the---.

Glen Taul

He was a Georgetown College graduate too?

J. Robert Snyder

No

Glen Taul

Wasn't he?

J. Robert Snyder

No, he came from Georgia.

Glen Taul

Oh, all right. It was his son--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--That came.

J. Robert Snyder

I really don't remember.

Glen Taul

Yeah, he--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--Was here during the 70s.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

With me.

J. Robert Snyder

He had three boys.

Glen Taul

Yeah. Well, one of them came here. [laughter]

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

What--hat about the social life? What were you involved in as far as the social activities of the college?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, it was different, because you're pretty well confined to the campus. Very few people had cars and only the veterans and the entertainment was--was here. They were--no one was really worried about it. The BSU [Baptist Student Union], there were all kinds of activities and the Greek groups had their entertainment. We had chapel twice a week, where we all came together. See, we don't do that anymore. The whole--the student body came and had an assigned seat, everybody had an assigned seat.

Glen Taul

Oh.

J. Robert Snyder

And everybody came together and it was worship and it was all kinds of other things. But I'm not awa--that just doesn't happen anymore, that the entire student body comes together in one place, twice a week. When I came, they were doing it in Giddings, and they had to divide the student body, they only took half at one time. In that--over there, there was an auditorium. They only took half of the student body at one time and they had a chapel, once a week and then they.

Glen Taul

Now okay, you--your family came in '48?

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

You weren't going to college then. John L. Hill Chapel was not completed when you started?

J. Robert Snyder

--It was under construction.

Glen Taul

It was under construction when you came.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

So they did have chapel in Giddings, is that on the first floor?

J. Robert Snyder

Right, yeah. There was an auditorium on the first floor.

Glen Taul

Do you know if that's where they were having chapel after the old chapel building burned?

J. Robert Snyder

Sure. It was the original chapel. Before this--there was a building next door here that was built, called the Literary Society--Library Building. They had a track and a basketball court in it, actually a gymnasium.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

-It was a small building, you wouldn't believe how it was in that one building. But when that burned, they went back to the--Giddings originally had a room in the front there.

Glen Taul

Of course, Giddings, from the very start when it was built, was an all-purpose building.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, everything was there.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

You had faculty offices, president's office--.

J. Robert Snyder

The registrar.

Glen Taul

Registrar's office--.

J. Robert Snyder

Science laboratories.

Glen Taul

And all those kinds of things in the chapel where, I guess the Maskrafters had to--.

J. Robert Snyder

They weren't around--.

Glen Taul

Perform.

J. Robert Snyder

--Then that--they had, after the John L. Chapel was finished, then they took that room in Giddings and they converted it into Lewis Auditorium.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

With--with seats and stage and a staircase went downstairs and they dressed downstairs. In--below all of it.

Glen Taul

Yeah. Yeah, I remembered that, when I was here in early 70s. It was right at the end of my time here, that they had got a grant to restore or renovate--.

J. Robert Snyder

Renovate--. Giddings--. --Maybe? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Right. Right.

Glen Taul

Into what it is now.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

So the president's office was in the back of Giddings when you were here. Who was when you--

J. Robert Snyder

President Hill? Samuel Hill.

Glen Taul

He was president all of---during the time you were here.

J. Robert Snyder

Then he moved into the back of John L. Hill Chapel Road, right, gosh, 1952, somewhere along in there.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Then they moved over here. But, when I came, his office and the Dean's office and my father's office, who was registrar and director of admissions, were all in the first floor.

Glen Taul

Of John L. Hill Chapel?

J. Robert Snyder

No, no, of Giddings.

Glen Taul

Of Giddings.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, then, then they moved over here to John L. Hill Chapel and the admissions and director and the registrar and Dean of Men were on the--in the basement, on the west side. And on the east side here, that was the business offices and the president's offices in the back, and the Dean's office, on the first, main floor of it. You can't--walked right into the president's office and the Dean's office.

Glen Taul

Okay. Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

But all administrative offices were pretty much in that--in the chapel built--John L. Hill Chapel building.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Now, it's there. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Goodness, what were some of the activities that you were involved in?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, I never thought we were cut off or iso--looking back on it. We didn't have a car. I didn't know how to drive, actually. Because there was so many things going on, and since I was taking a pretty heavy load five, six courses a semester, and all those things. And I was in the chapel choir that and I got into the KA [Kappa Alpha] fraternity for--just one year--and I--.

Glen Taul

Only a year?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, I was only here three years. I graduated. And I ran track, which , at a big school, I would never been able to do.

Glen Taul

Oh, really?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah. I ran the two mile.

Glen Taul

You were at--and that was your competition. I mean, your--.

J. Robert Snyder

Athletic.

Glen Taul

--Event?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, right.

Glen Taul

How did you do in that?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, lettered. I wasn't really the fastest. It didn't matter how fast you were in that race. it's just who finished. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

It was endurance.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. Right, you're right.

Glen Taul

Who was the coach then?

J. Robert Snyder

Brad Jones.

Glen Taul

Okay. What was he like?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, he gave the impression of being a very tough athletic coach. He had a--had a great reputation in Louisville And he'd been in the state tournament with a basketball team out of Frankfort at one time. So, he'd done it all. And he's the one that's responsible for the fee--on the track and all kinds of things. And he was sort of a gruff kind of fellow, but--he had--had to in what--the business he was. To be sure you kept all the equipment and schedule. He was the athletic director, basically.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

He didn't--really didn't coach much. Ex--he did track. Coached track.

Glen Taul

He coach track then he had other coaches for football and--.

J. Robert Snyder

--And bas---.

Glen Taul

--Tennis and basketball.

J. Robert Snyder

Basketball. They did golf, too.

Glen Taul

And golf and baseball, probably.

J. Robert Snyder

He never messed with baseball, but the baseball field was right out here. He's the one that arranged that. You wouldn't believe it--that baseball field was right there beside the football field.

Glen Taul

Beside it not--they didn't switch--alternate--.

J. Robert Snyder

Well--.

Glen Taul

--Between it.

J. Robert Snyder

Now that--the football field, part of it became the outfield.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And they always had to take down a light tower to do that. So, it was an experience watching that in the--in the spring.

Glen Taul

My gosh.

J. Robert Snyder

--Just one of the light poles had been taken down. So they could play baseball. But it was not a bad idea, really.

Glen Taul

Well, that was--it must have been pretty hard ground to play on. I mean, I walk over that.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, no, see, it's not the same as it was then because Brad was very careful, he carefully nurtured bluegrass sod right--like in the orchard or the fields out here on the farm. It was not laid down grass like we have out here now.

Glen Taul

Oh, okay.

J. Robert Snyder

it was about that thick. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Oh, it was?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah, it was beautiful, and they tore it all up. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

What they do, put some rock, dirt in there or? To make--it seems like it's harder.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah--they came in and they cut another ditch on the other side and trying to crown it, make it kind of a curvature to it. And then they brought in sod, which all died [chuckles] most of it. You can see the remnants of the old field, in the corners, if you're ever out there.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

In the corners, that's what Brad.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Filled in, yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay. And he had been here a long time?

J. Robert Snyder

No, not really. He came in 43', 1943. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

So, he'd only been here five years when I came.

Glen Taul

But he was an alumnus.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Too.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Who else was here of note?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, Dick Scutter (??) came in sociology, I never had a class under him, and in geography. And Coleman Arnold was my English teacher.

Glen Taul

Now he's had--he has a fairly significant reputation on campus?

J. Robert Snyder

Coleman Arnold?

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, he was an interesting guy. He--The Georgetonian, and that was under him and all kinds of stuff like that, yeah.

Glen Taul

Well, I mean, what was--what was distinctive about Coleman Arnold? But you've never had him for class, I take it.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah. Sure--sure.

Glen Taul

Oh, you did? Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

He was just a solid teacher with a good sense of humor. Not even not--I wouldn't have called him charismatic exactly. He just saw it with a sense of humor, I mean, that's the best way.

Glen Taul

Was he primarily a lecturer?

J. Robert Snyder

No, it was sort of half and half, I used his technique today actually. It was sort of a conversational approach, of course, he was teaching, you know, basic English and--

Glen Taul

Basic English.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah and then English literature.

Glen Taul

Did you have him for English literature?

J. Robert Snyder

I must have, I don't know---no, no, I had Dr. Jones for that. Dr. Jones, he was still living.

Glen Taul

W.B. Jones?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. Had him in summer school, acutally

Glen Taul

Okay. But Dr. Arnold, of course, he was here when I was here, in the early 70s. Still teaching, and he's an alumnus. I mean, he came across very much as a very methodical, quiet type of person.

J. Robert Snyder

Right, yeah.

Glen Taul

I mean, how did students I mean, what I mean, what was--how did he teach? I mean, we've already talked about he wasn't a lecture so much, but?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, the best evidence of that is down in the English department area downstairs, his picture is down there, his portrait is on the first floor of this building. And I think that's the best evidence of how he got along students.

Glen Taul

Okay. Was Woodridge (??) Spears here then?

J. Robert Snyder

He came right after that. I--don't I never had him in class, no.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Orlin Corey came about that--at the end of that period of time. He was the drama and his wife, Mrs. Cory was the--she had the whole art department by herself.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And Orlin Corey did the drama. And the tradition had come because of--that they always have a Shakespearean play. And I think he had a severe conflict with the administration over that. [chuckles] Because that was a major production every year to do the Shakespearian play.

Glen Taul

--Play. In other words--.

J. Robert Snyder

Lewis Auditorium, which is nearly not suited for that.

Glen Taul

He didn't want to do a Shakespearean play then?

J. Robert Snyder

No, but it got just too big--a big thing--a big thing.

Glen Taul

It was a big--it was a lot to put together?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, absoutley, sure.

Glen Taul

--The scenery and--.

J. Robert Snyder

Money.

Glen Taul

--A bit--okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And then he--there were differences with the president, right after I left over whether the college would be moved. I wasn't invol--

Glen Taul

Oh, yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

I wasn't involved in that.

Glen Taul

No, you weren't involved in that.

J. Robert Snyder

Corey, I think and others, were really upset with Dr. [H. Leo] Eddleman about an attempt to move Georgetown College to Louisville.

Glen Taul

What kind of reputation did Dr. Hill have among the college community, during your time?

J. Robert Snyder

I don't think I ever had a conversation with him, I knew his daughter real well, Janie Hill is her name. And his--an older son, Sam Hill, Jr. My impression was he was rather stiff, very conservative. Autocratic, I think he presented at the faculty meetings and there was no discussion.

Glen Taul

Oh, is that right?

J. Robert Snyder

--That's--he just ran it like he had run his churches always like. But, you really needed somebody like at--at that time tested--who keeps developing and you wanted good relations with the Kentucky Baptist Convention, because money had been cut off in--about 1939 or '40, along in therem the convention had cut all the money off. And Dr--with Dr. Hill, coming in, there was--there was--that was relief--that was stopped and the money had accrued actually, it was in escrow.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And he took that money and just repaired the campus, is really what they did. They had to re--every building just about, it was falling down, it was in bad shape.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

They didn't have a drive--Memorial Drive out here. All those things had to be fixed. And that money--that's the way they got it. And [clears throat] there was a very close relationship between Kentucky Baptist and the school. I would imagine two thirds of the student body, were Kentucky Baptist kids. But there was a third, who were veterans and a lot of other things.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Didn't he leave, just as you were graduating, or just a--after--.

J. Robert Snyder

He left after I--after I left.

Glen Taul

Okay. Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

He was up in years and--maybe in his 60s. But at that time, yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay. Somebody--yeah. So--so what were some of the other traditions that you remember? What were the traditions that the students followed, back in your time?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, because of the closeness, and I think you the--BSU was a lot stronger, among the student body, had a choir of its own The ministerial society was a pretty good sized group. There were a lot of kids that were going to be missionaries. And you know, there was--it was a literally a sub unit to the Southern Seminary in Louisville. We sent maybe 10 or 15 down there every year to the all the schools that they had down there, music and, and theology and all the rest of it there, that's gone. And it's because of the nature, the fact that kids didn't have cars, you had to invent ways to to entertain, and one of the strangest traditions--kids came on the train to school, they would bring their trunks with them. And the train would bring them over here to the station that's just over the hill from the college here. Part of the BSU or student body would meet them and help them get into the dorm. Same with the bus station.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

There might be 200 or 300 would come that way, every first of September.

Glen Taul

So where was the trust--train Station, it was--?

J. Robert Snyder

On Meadow Street, which is the one--two blocks over--two blocks over.

Glen Taul

Okay, toward the east? Or the--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

I guess that's the east.

J. Robert Snyder

The railroads had to tear it down because they felt it was too big a liability.

Glen Taul

Oh, really?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah---there was--.

Glen Taul

Now, where was the bus station located?

J. Robert Snyder

The bus station was right down where the fire station is.

Glen Taul

Downtown?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. Actually, that's an old car barn for inner-urban rail transportation. That's what that was built for. And that was the bus station.

Glen Taul

Didn't there used to be, before your time, tracks going on--

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Jackson Street. Is that where the railroad came, or was that a inner city transportation?

J. Robert Snyder

No, it was neither. As I was informed by Clem (??) Smith after I had wrote my book, and he Crit--[chuckles]--said he should--"you didn't have that right." There was a small railroad, I don't think it was near a gauge, a regular gauge, but it was just a small railroad, which ran from the train station, up the hill ,down Jackson here, down to the bottom of the hill, where there was a ice factory down there. They--

Glen Taul

Oh.

J. Robert Snyder

--Made ice and then it came back up College Street and went on back out to the railroad station. There was an interurban, which ran from the fire station, the pl--where the fire station is downtown right now. That was the interurban.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Which had rather large cars, single cars. And that would take you all the way to Lexington and back and you could change in Lexington and go to Winchester, Frankfort, Nicholasville all kinds of stuff, Paris.

Glen Taul

Now, did any of the students use the Interurban to go to Lexington from time to time?

J. Robert Snyder

---Sure, that was their entertainment, if they had any money. [chuckles] But there--

Glen Taul

How much did it cost to go--?

J. Robert Snyder

I remember seeing--it couldn't have been very much. It was not--they carried freight--they carried all kinds of stuff. The cars were rather large, maybe the length of this building. And when I came, there was--they weren't some of those things--similar cars were on the F&C [Frankfort and Cincinnati] railway, which ran from Frankfort to Georgetown, came in at the same station. They had single cars and went on to Paris.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

But the main that--we had two other railroads. The one out here is a Norfolk Southern, it was a Southern Railway at that time and it was one of the best in the United States. In fact, it has never lost money. And it was double-tracked all the way from Cincinnati to Chattanooga, and there were trains all the time out there. Good passenger service. Some of the be--crack passenger trains in the nation came through Georgetown. The Floridian was one of--the Ponce de Leon was another on. The Carolina Special. You know, there were maybe six or eight trains a day, passengers trains.

Glen Taul

Goodness.

J. Robert Snyder

You could get all over--the state. And then we had L&N [Louisville and Nashville Railroad] railway out here at Paynes Depot, that's the origin of that name, Paynes Depot.

Glen Taul

Paynes Depot, yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

I don't remember any depot being out there, but when it crossed U.S. 62 out there.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

That--that probably was a depot of some sort. That was the first one, that was built in about 1840.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

That came from Louisville to Lexington.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

So you--you could the--the store in the--catalogs, they say, you can put your trunk on the dadgum train in Texas and get up here with that trunk on the train until you get to the front of Rucker Hall.

Glen Taul

Really?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. As--you--have to change trains.

Glen Taul

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

But you would always be on a train, on some kind of rail system, all the way to Rucker or Pawling, either one, this building--.

Glen Taul

This building.

J. Robert Snyder

Same thing. Rucker is a little closer to the street, than we are. That was right on it.

Glen Taul

That's true. It was--.

J. Robert Snyder

Right on the street, they didn't have any yard.

Glen Taul

Yeah, that's true. --It really was.

J. Robert Snyder

It may have been built for that purpose, honestly, come to think of it. So, it was maybe, 15, 20 feet to the street. But it was built in sort of a curve.

Glen Taul

Yes, it was--

J. Robert Snyder

It wasn't straight, it was a curve.

Glen Taul

It was--it was like a crescent.

J. Robert Snyder

Had turrets.

Glen Taul

Exactly.

J. Robert Snyder

Above the parlors

Glen Taul

Exactly.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

What kind of forms of entertainment did the students get involved in--in Lexington?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, some good, some bad. [laughter] I don't remember too much trouble with that. Sometimes the Greeks would have their meetings over there, social gathering. Since we didn't have much here, just the--the Lancaster Hotel is what was called then, Main and Broadway, where the First National Bank--First National Bank, that was the Lancaster Hotel.

Glen Taul

Oh, it was?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, it was about five or six stores.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And they had a beautiful ballroom, beautiful ballroom. Best dance floor I have ever seen or like that since. I don't know what kind of wood they had on there. They also had a speakeasy downstairs and a pool hall and all kinds of stuff, so.

Glen Taul

They still called them speakeasies back in the 50s?

J. Robert Snyder

No, I think had been closed. There was a room behind the pool room, that I understand, that was the speakeasy.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Well, I mean, Georgetown--was Georgetown dry during your time here?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, it had gone dry during the war--Second--.

Glen Taul

World War II--.

J. Robert Snyder

Second World War.

Glen Taul

That must have happened ,and that happened to a lot of communities in Kentucky.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

They went dry during the war.

J. Robert Snyder

It didn't mean that we were really dry because there was, people would hire taxis, to go five miles up the road. You know, there was a liquor store on the county lines.

Glen Taul

Yeah like there is--. [tape cuts off]

J. Robert Snyder

Things working well.

Glen Taul

What this---what this does is--

J. Robert Snyder

It needed a new microphone.

Glen Taul

Yeah. This is one of those table mics where you and I--

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah.

Glen Taul

can both?

J. Robert Snyder

You don't have to put it up there.

Glen Taul

That's right. They were suggesting that over there at the oral history commission, of using that kind of a mic.

J. Robert Snyder

But, I'm trying to--is this on?

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

I'm just trying to think of some other phenomena. My--when my father was the director of admissions, the enrollment doubled, while he was doing that.

Glen Taul

This was while you were here?

J. Robert Snyder

I think the doubling was made by 67-'68.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Somewhere along in there. Or maybe it was a little bit earlier than, that during the Vietnam War, actually.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

But, you have to remember that the conditions back then--in the 50s, we didn't have a lot of competition. The Campbellsville and Cumberland were junior colleges, were more like community college. There was no northern school, not even community colleges up there in northern Kentucky.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And you did have a few community--Ashland was in there and Bethel College at Russellville, or Hopkinsville, I guess. It went out of business, it was a Baptist school--.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Or two Bethels, actually. And the universities were not quite as prominent. There was the University of Kentucky, which is the four-year land grant a&m university. The University of Louisville was fairly small because it was a municipal University. It was--.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

--Financed by the city of Louisville.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

--In Jefferson County. And, Eastern and Western, Murray, and Moorhead were colleges, state normal colleges.

Glen Taul

They were teachers colleges.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, not university.

Glen Taul

What about Transy? [Transylvania University]

J. Robert Snyder

So. Transy was there but, I don't think we ever looked upon them as a--competitor.

Glen Taul

Competitor.

J. Robert Snyder

They had their own problems because they were breaking off from the Christians--Disciples of Christ Church. They were really a university because they had the=--the Lexington Theological Seminary was right across the street there. But that moves and then was completely separates. And Centre [College] was a very small, very small, maybe 600 people down there. So--I think my father felt we can--come--where the competition came in is when they all switched to universities and the--Cambellsville and Cumberland, in that big fight over whether to move Georgetown College. The resolution of that was to leave Georgetown where it was, to make Cambellsville and Cumberland four-year schools and then put money into Kentucky Southern, a new school, actually in Jefferson County--it was not in--not actually in the city limits of Louisville. Beautiful campus. Totally unrealistic.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Because the state of Kentucky, the very next year--the next year, it must have been--the mid-60s. The very next year, when Louie Nunn became Governor of Kentucky, the University of Louisville was taken into the state system and they cut the tuition in half.

Glen Taul

Oh!

J. Robert Snyder

And Northern was started and that was a totally new competitor up there.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Four year university in that area.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

So we were lucky to be a alive. [laughter] You know. Enrollment, it sort of stabilized, I don't think it really dropped a lot, it sort of stabilized. Probably because of the--the federal programs that came in--during the Lyndon Johnson, the Great Society stuff. Where you had all kinds of things you didn't have before, such as work study, national direct student loans. And--.

Glen Taul

So, they were basically replacing what the GI Bill did?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, and better. It was actually better.. The GI Bill, you didn't make any money off that. That was about $100 a month. That's all you got.

Glen Taul

And that was supposed to pay for housing--.

J. Robert Snyder

Everything.

Glen Taul

--Books.

J. Robert Snyder

Everything.

Glen Taul

everything.

J. Robert Snyder

Sure.

Glen Taul

What kind of entertainment did--did y'all have on campus?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, we every dorm, especially Rucker, and the sororities and others had all kinds of socials and meetings, and didn't have dances.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

I don't think we ever felt--we really worried about that. Hay rides and, you were in your group or another group and the interaction was there, you didn't have to date particularly because, I was in the chapel choir.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Which I--we--everybody got to know each other. We took trips all over the country. So I don't think--I never really, there were some astounding (??) events, even in athletics. I'll telling Billy Brannock (??). I don't know if you ever talked to him.

Glen Taul

Oh, yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Billy Brannock. I remember him. He's a fairly small fella. He was a halfback on the football team. He was a veteran and they played Western Kentucky State Normal College out here, which is now Western Kentucky University, and nearly beat them. And they didn't have maybe 30 people on the team. The whole team was only about 30 people.

Glen Taul

Because each person played the offense and defense.

J. Robert Snyder

Both ways. Both ways.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

But, they nearly beat Western out. It was--the score was 12 to 6, was that I remember, 12 or 13.

Glen Taul

That is almost beating them.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

And y'all didn't have the extra points back then. I guess you didn't have the extra points?

J. Robert Snyder

No, they had extra points.

Glen Taul

Oh they--.

J. Robert Snyder

I don't remember what--what happened. But it was maybe 12, 13, to 6 or 7, something like that. But it was a very--for-- it was an oustanding [chuckles] was--. The difference was that all the line were veterans --from the army and the Marine Corps and stuff.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

As was Billy. Maybe they had a few fresh, fresh faces [laughter] right out of high school. But they were all you know, older people.

Glen Taul

So what was the track? I mean, how did the track program operate?

J. Robert Snyder

With Brad we competed against--sometimes in triple. You know, you bring three schools together. And I ran at Morehead, I ran at Berea. Not at Transy, I meant Centre. It was a schedule of schools from all over the state.

Glen Taul

Did--.

J. Robert Snyder

All the events. Well, we had some--bad--some--that's one we had to do away with. They had to javelin, used to the javelin and stopped that because we didn't have an accent here, but I think there was a boy killed in Kentucky someplace at that time. But the track out there was a 440 track.

Glen Taul

Now what is a 440 track?

J. Robert Snyder

That's one turn around.

Glen Taul

Okay,

J. Robert Snyder

But, it was, it was a perfect, not what it is today, they've changed it.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

It was a perfect 440. And then--he Mr. Porter had paid--I think he paid for the building of 100 yard dash right here. It started there--it came right out this way. That was the 100 yard---.

Glen Taul

You mean, it started near the students center?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. There was a 100 yards--track.

Glen Taul

And it went out toward the Hinton Field?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And they had--.

Glen Taul

--And it was a straight shot?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. 100 yards.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

I think they ran the 220 there too, for 220, you had to go on out on the football field.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And they did the hurdles here too. So we don't do anything like that anymore. We had low hurdles and we had high levels.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

On this track right here.

Glen Taul

Were the tracks--I mean, what--what were they made of?

J. Robert Snyder

This one was made of cinders.

Glen Taul

The 100 yard dash--?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, the 100 yard was cinders. The other one was dirt, primarily.

Glen Taul

Primarily dirt.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

They didn't know about--.

J. Robert Snyder

Asphalt. They just couldn't afford it. Eventually, they did.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

It was blacktopped.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

But--in my memory, it was mostly dirt. But--.

Glen Taul

Is that?

J. Robert Snyder

--You only ran the 440 and 890 and mile-- two mile, just those four, use the big track. The big oblong track, yeah.

Glen Taul

How did he condition you, Brad Jones?

J. Robert Snyder

He left it pretty much up to each individual.

Glen Taul

Is that right?

J. Robert Snyder

You--conditioned year-round. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Oh, you conditioned year-round.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, oh, yeah. I ran--.

Glen Taul

So he didn't give you any kind of guided program to.

J. Robert Snyder

No.

Glen Taul

I mean, you might do it on your own, but no guided program to get into condition.

J. Robert Snyder

No. No. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

And you didn't practice together?

J. Robert Snyder

We didn't do too much practicing together. Not--for what I did, I ran on the railway, right away. That was the best place to do that. The Southern Railway right away was just excellent. It was cinders and it went for 10 miles out here.

Glen Taul

Oh, okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And just to get--you get out there and ran as hard as--long as you could stay up. That was the way to get in condition.

Glen Taul

Okay, so you didn't go lifting weights or--.

J. Robert Snyder

Not for those races.

Glen Taul

--Of that kind?

J. Robert Snyder

No.

Glen Taul

So, that's how you basically conditioned yourself, you just ran long distances--.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

--As hard as you could.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Every day?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, a few days, it took eight laps, around the track for two mile.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And you'd run that 8 times. The mile was 4 times.

Glen Taul

Right.

J. Robert Snyder

880 was two and 440 was four.

Glen Taul

I guess that standard had never changed for--no--for telling when.

J. Robert Snyder

That's based on meters. The mile is a U.S., American invention, to be honest about it.

Glen Taul

Usually, I understand that the inner lane is a forth a mile around.

J. Robert Snyder

Right. Right.

Glen Taul

And then of course, the outer lanes would be a little bit greater--.

J. Robert Snyder

--And he had lanes marked off.

Glen Taul

Oh, even on the cinders in the dirt?

J. Robert Snyder

I'm not sure it went all the way around, maybe at the starting. Where they--you started right out here in front of the football stadium.

Glen Taul

So, it really didn't matter if you were in lanes or not, when you were competing the two mile--.

J. Robert Snyder

Not in all the races races, no it didn't make any difference. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Everybody has jostling for position.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, you just spread out. [laughter] It never was a problem though. [laughter]

Glen Taul

How--if you were running a track, how was your strategy as far as trying to win? Was there a strategy?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, the strategy, you just, you got it in your mind, I was just thinking about this a while ago, I was out there walking. You've got in your mind that you're not gonna think about it. You just do what you have to do. As long as you can hold out. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

As long as you--so you don't really try to pace yourself in any kind of way?

J. Robert Snyder

And, of course--primarily, the strategy was to--in what I did was seven laps around and on the forth one is where you tried to kick.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Maybe the half--half way.

Glen Taul

So, you just really, basically try to keep in position--.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

--For seven laps, near the front.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

If you're--if you don't want to really take the lead maybe.

J. Robert Snyder

Not really, no.

Glen Taul

In the early stages.

J. Robert Snyder

You didn't worry about leads, just so you stayed up there. And then--.

Glen Taul

Somewhere in position where you could kick--.

J. Robert Snyder

And it's the last, everybody else would start falling out, [chuckles] exhausted.

Glen Taul

Yeah--well--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--Did many people come out to see track and field events?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, there wasn't a lot else to do on the campus, so you know, yeah, sure, sure.

Glen Taul

I didn't know--.

J. Robert Snyder

--It was right her.

Glen Taul

Right out here.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

So everybody--.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, maybe a couple hundred here and there. But, all the athletics, football, basketball, basketball, everything, track, was right here.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Within eyeshot.

Glen Taul

What was the se--when was the season?

J. Robert Snyder

tTack was usually in the spring.

Glen Taul

Okay. So it really hasn't changed all that much as far as--.

J. Robert Snyder

No--I'm really--I really wish we had kept it. But that was another expense they didn't want to do, I guess in a new stadium.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

The space is there, by the way.

Glen Taul

If they can pick it up later.

J. Robert Snyder

Well then, most schools are not interested in that. High schools do it, but most colleges don't.

Glen Taul

They're into more soccer now, I guess.

J. Robert Snyder

Soccer.

Glen Taul

That--that--.

J. Robert Snyder

For the kids--

Glen Taul

---To sort of replace track.

J. Robert Snyder

The high school students, soccer--soccer's a tough sport.

Glen Taul

Yeah. It is.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, we do it for both men and women. See, you didn't track for women back then. You didn't have a whole lot of women's sports period.

Glen Taul

Well, what were the women's sports in the--when you were here?

J. Robert Snyder

I don't think they had basketball--or any of those things.

Glen Taul

I was noticing in the early annuals of Georgetown, like the early 1900s, that women did have basketball.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--And they had tennis.

J. Robert Snyder

Women's golf--.

Glen Taul

And--

J. Robert Snyder

There was a field hockey field--it was a field behind Rucker Hall, where they had field hockey or something too.

Glen Taul

For women?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, Rucker Hall was sort of self--contained then--they were over there.

Glen Taul

I know.

J. Robert Snyder

There was a build room called Eupian (??) Hall, which was for drama and speech, and I mean, it's not very big, but it was--it served its purpose. The cafeteria was in--in the east side, so called Bristow (??) Hall. And they had to--it was virtually a small college in itself.

Glen Taul

Did--you were mentioning about that you didn't have a cafeteria when you came. Where did the students eat? Their meals.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, the--there was a grill, sort of a hamburger place in--but that was with the bookstore in the army building--between John L. Hill Chapel and Giddings.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

I there was a grill. I guess that's--and a lot of them ate in the homes where they boarded.

Glen Taul

So, a lot of students boarded?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, and sometimes--we didn't do that but, sometimes they ate there too. You got that as a package. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Well, that's why they used to call them boarding houses.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Isn't it.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Were you ever, now I noticed in the annual that you were president of the KA.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

That year.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah--my one year.

Glen Taul

Now had did that get to--how did you get that position?

J. Robert Snyder

Nobody else wanted it.

Glen Taul

Nobody else wanted it?

J. Robert Snyder

Right, yeah.

Glen Taul

Well, what was the reputation of the Kappa Alphas--on campus when you were here?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, it wasn't too bad--that--they did have their parties off campus but nobody really thought about drinking parties and. They have had a dance, over at Joyland or something like that.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

You--pretty serious, I think now. Everybody's trying to stay in school and survive and--and get through. You didn't worry about that.

Glen Taul

what was their mascot or whatever. Is it anything like it is today?

J. Robert Snyder

No, they didn't mess with the Southern stuff too much, no. The--Robert E. Lee's birthday and having parties dressed up like Confederate soldiers. Well, they do now, Big South. No, they didn't have any of that stuff, yeah.

Glen Taul

So, it was a pretty serious thing.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, and they didn't worry about homecoming and you know, a lot--half the guys were veterans.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And they were way beyond that kind of stuff. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Okay. They had enough partying [laughs] during the war.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, they wanted, they were on GI Bill and they wanted to graduate and you know, they didn't stay out all night.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

At all hours of the night. You know, they were here to get out. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Now, the house that they lived in.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Did you ever live--you never did live there?

J. Robert Snyder

No. No

Glen Taul

Did--did some of the KAs live there?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah sure, about maybe 30.

Glen Taul

Was at that the largest on campus?

J. Robert Snyder

I suspect the Pi Kap House has the biggest.

Glen Taul

The Pi Kap House.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, it was right out in front of the president's house.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Across the street there.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

That's-- a pretty good sized building.

Glen Taul

Okay, what was their reputation on campus?

J. Robert Snyder

About the same. They were all about the same. The LCAs were up the street. They were--.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

--All about the--there wasn't a whole lot of difference.

Glen Taul

Was there any independents?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh yeah--

Glen Taul

Social clubs.

J. Robert Snyder

No--not---no, well, the BSU, [Baptist Student Union] groups like that. Most of the student body were independent. You know, they were not in the Greeks.

Glen Taul

Oh, so the--.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah.

Glen Taul

--Independents made up most of the--the. Yeah. Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Of course, Rucker Hall was--that's where the girls were. All were there--.

Glen Taul

And then you had Pawling Hall, that was the men's. The was the only--Pawling Hall was the only men's dorm on campus--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

--At the time.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Bcause Anderson wasn't built until after you left?

J. Robert Snyder

1957.

Glen Taul

Yeah. Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

So, you had Pawling Hall--was it still--Pawling Hall still meant for ministerial students or was it just?

J. Robert Snyder

Most of them were here, yeah. This was mostly ministerial, not all of them.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And then you had the Sigma Kappas and the KDs [Kappa Delta] . Sigma Kappa Houses was over on Main Street. Right--.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

--Next to the president and the KD house was on Estill Court.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And then you had the three fraternities. The KAs [Kappa Alpha] were down here on South Hamilton. But Pi Kaps [Pi Kappa Alpha] are on--on Main Street--and Chambers Avenue.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And the LCAs were about a half a block up the street.

Glen Taul

Now, hat were the LCAs?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, well, they were just another fraternity. Yeah, about halfway.

Glen Taul

Was that a Greek fraternity?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, sure.

Glen Taul

Oh, okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Men. Men.

Glen Taul

Okay. Okay. I didn't realize--I'd never heard of LCAs.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, well--they're still open.

Glen Taul

I was ready--I was ready to get them--call them the Ladies Christian Association. [laughs]

J. Robert Snyder

No--there's they have a building over here now still.

Glen Taul

Oh, okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay. So, you lived at home? You--and so and you were in walking distance?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, absolutely. Sure.

Glen Taul

Of home, so that really made it nice.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

The--what some of the other, Dr. Hill started this building program, and I think, and of course, John L. Chapel is his main--.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Project.

J. Robert Snyder

Right.

Glen Taul

Getting it done and then--.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

Georgetown didn't have a science center until the 60s. Right, so they--all they had was those barracks down in the southeast.

J. Robert Snyder

Well, physics was in the bottom of--basement of Giddings.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

And math was in what we call Highbaugh Hall, today. That was math upstairs.

Glen Taul

Did you--.

J. Robert Snyder

Foreign language--

Glen Taul

--Have classes in Highbaugh?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, sure. Math was--had one room upstairs.

Glen Taul

Okay. Now when I was here, I thought they had two rooms upstairs.

J. Robert Snyder

Well there might--there were a lot of rooms--.

Glen Taul

--I had a literature class.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, right. There were other classrooms, but that one room had been Rucker's--Professor Rucker's classroom.

Glen Taul

Is that right?

J. Robert Snyder

For fifty years.

Glen Taul

I didn't realize that.

J. Robert Snyder

Then Dr. Hatfield took that room over.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah. That was math.

Glen Taul

So, he taught in that building?

J. Robert Snyder

Right?

Glen Taul

Oh, that's--.

J. Robert Snyder

I never didn't take any biology, but biology was in that army barracks, building. In the far corner, as was the business by the--all the business classes were down there too.

Glen Taul

Okay, what was the library facilities like?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, the main library had burned right next door, had burned in 1930.

Glen Taul

Right.

J. Robert Snyder

Some books--that--it was a slow burn, it was not, like we think of in a a big fire, kind of thing. It burned that entire day. So, they were able to get in there and get out a good bit of it. And it was put in, what was called The Arts and Crafts Building. That's where the Ensor Libr--learning resource--where your office is.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

There was a building--a very substantial building was sitting there, called the Arts and Crafts Building.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

It was really built for machinery [chuckles] to produce cloth and--it had looms and things for the students to work and go to school.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

On the Berea College model, that was their model, it never worked.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

But, that building was sitting there, so they took the--the books they had left, maybe 20,000 of them. It was a pretty good chunk, and they put them on the main floor.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Of that building downstairs, the was religion--there was religion class, that was the religion classroom. And upstairs on the third, the third floor, I guess originally, it was the periodicals, bound periodicals and things like that. So it wasn't a very big operation, it was enough. We--didn't worry about it that much. And the--Virginia Covington was the librarian throughout that whole period of time.

Glen Taul

During your time.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah.

Glen Taul

--Of course she was during my time.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, sure.

Glen Taul

Also, what was she like, in your day? Here?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, I got along with a real well, she was very--.

Glen Taul

What kind of personality she had have?

J. Robert Snyder

Outgoing, sometimes authoritarian, [chuckles] which you had to be to run that build--that kind of operation down there. But she was--she was right on you in every room and made sure that it was quiet and studying. And with the limited resources that she had, I thought she did a pretty good job. Everything considered, I never felt the need to go anywhere else, actually. On the internet [laughter], didn't have anything like that. No, it was good.

Glen Taul

What was the scientific equipment like, do you think?

J. Robert Snyder

Wellm, physics was the one that was--probably could be criticized because it was basically in two rooms in the bas--basement of Giddings But he was H.Y. Mulligan (??) was a very innovative, creative person. And he brought astronomy to the campus and we had--for the basic experiments we were doning, it was probably enough. And up on the third floor of Giddings were the chemistry labs. I never took chemistry. But they were very creative. Dr. Alexander was the head--did that. He actually converted the fourth floor of Giddings into a lab. That was a chemistry lab.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

We call the Deans Room.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

That was a chemistry lab that he actually built himself.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

So it was--the basics were there. It wasn't anything you know, there was a problem of create--new machinery and inventions and I guess today, but the basics were there, yeah.

Glen Taul

Okay. Okay. Were you at the dedication ceremony for the chapel?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, sure.

Glen Taul

What was it like?

J. Robert Snyder

Well, it went on a whole week, that's in my book. The--that was an experience because Dr. [Samuel] Hill tried to bring in top leaders of the Baptist denomination from all over the country. And I remember John L Hill, he was a very distinguished, had white hair. He maybe have been five nine or so, but he was a bulk of a man, big head. And he was--the--he was the first Dean of Georgetown College, when he left. And he became the book editor, an official in the Southern Baptist Sunday School Board in Nashville. And he taught a Sunday school class for women, which had several hundred women in it. I think it's the First Baptist Church of Nashville.

Glen Taul

It was.

J. Robert Snyder

And when he came up for the dedication, those women came with him. A busloads of them, came up here with him--at--when he spoke. And I think they may have had the president of the Baptist World Alliance, you know, it went on and on there for an entire week. As a church--related exercise which you can, obviously the building was intended as a chapel type church, stained glass windows and all the rest of it. So, it was--and the choir--our choirs were great. The music was great and it was--it was a grand experience.

Glen Taul

Now, did your chorale sing there?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah, sure.

Glen Taul

What were the interior decoration or interior like? We had the stained glass window, but?

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah. Well, there were some basic problems with the design of the building, which we're gonna have to correct to--came out of (??) The aisles--there was one big aisle down the middle.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And everybody's complained about that because when the speaker gets up, he's talking to the aisle. [chuckles]

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

What he sees is the big, huge aisle, like a--for a wedding or something.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

Right up the middle there. And the, the heating system was always a problem. And the--the sash waist (??) didn't work downstairs, it floods down in the basement even yet still. It was not--there was a problem with that. But it's a substantial building, there's no doubt about that.

Glen Taul

rRght.

J. Robert Snyder

And it was built--as a--I think as a philosophy was then, as an extension of the Kentucky Baptist Convention.

Glen Taul

Okay.

J. Robert Snyder

Church, that's what it was for.

Glen Taul

Where do you think they got the architect from--I mean, the architecture style of the buidling.

J. Robert Snyder

Well--it's basic church architecture.

Glen Taul

Southern Baptist Church architecture? [chuckles]

J. Robert Snyder

I don't remember where--

Glen Taul

For the 50s?

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, out of the 50s, that steeple and everything. Sure.

Glen Taul

I remember, it seems like from my childhood, and I grew--well, my first ten years of life was in the 50s.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah.

Glen Taul

That it seemed like the Southern Baptist Convention, they had the services, they offered churches if they'd ever build one.

J. Robert Snyder

Oh, yeah, sure. Architectural.

Glen Taul

Yeah. And it seems like it was sort of--. Like that. --Something like this.

J. Robert Snyder

Yeah, the--this has the false columns on the front, which sometimes, you had the real columns, real white. Grecian, actually (??)

Glen Taul

Style.

J. Robert Snyder

Ionic forms there. I think this is more Corinthian.

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

The--this is a sort of a false pause in the front, that's the only fusion (??) The main building itself probably was a standard form, yeah. When it started, but then as they went along, then they had to, add--they put all these things in, like the basement rooms and the offices up the back and all that stuff.

Glen Taul

Is that a--because they were starting to get--they got money in.

J. Robert Snyder

Right, or getting bigger, enrollment, sure. The enrollment doubled, actually enrolled--when that was started in 1946 or so, it probably was sufficien,t but the enrollment doubled within 46-'47. Yeah.

Glen Taul

Interesting.

J. Robert Snyder

Now, actually, it's too small today.

Glen Taul

We need it bigger.

J. Robert Snyder

I don't think anybody had any idea that we would be as big as we are now, yeah. It's more like they were figuring, oh, 500, 600

Glen Taul

Yeah.

J. Robert Snyder

And then we're about 1,700, so.

Glen Taul