Glen Taul
1:00This is an unrehearsed interview with Orlin Corey, professor of speech at
Georgetown college from 1952 to 1959. Dr. Glen Taul, archivist the interview took place in the inter Learning Resource Center at Georgetown College on September 9th--2002, --[What I'm]--interested in, is the different issues that surround every college during the time. And some of them are things that you're taught for years researching through your book. But first of all, tell me when you come to Georgetown and how--why did you come to Georgetown? How did you find out about it?Orlin Corey
2:00I was finishing a master's degree in drama at Baylor University in the spring,
early spring of 1952. Or winter. And at that time, I heard of the Southern Speech Association, which was meeting in Jackson, Mississippi that year. Now, whether they still exist 50 years later, I'm not sure but they weren't important at that time in the national scene. And I was advised it'd be good to go over there and seek a position. So in that time in my life, I was 26. I had been in the Navy the last two years in the Second World War, so a little behind by age. So I was about 26 at that time.Glen Taul
3:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
4:00And Rena Calhoun was there from Georgetown College in Kentucky.
Glen Taul
5:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
6:00And I was just aware of that name, I didn't know anything. And she was looking
for a person to come to the department I learned as and she was relying on her friend, Dr. Charles McLaughlin, (??) who headed the speech work at Southern Baptist Seminary in Louisville. And so she knew him here in the state. She was relying on him for advice. I think I saw him in reference to a master's thesis I was working on and then he suggested I talked to her. So I did. And about a month passes, and I was invited to send a resume. And it all went at a very leisurely pace. And would like to have an interview with me. Well, the interview wasn't feasible until we got to June that year, a couple of months later, but everything seemed copacetic. So that was okay. The interview was because my wife Irene, by name at that time and herself, a four year teacher art at Baylor with same age with the difference in the Navy and all that, so a difference in that. But she'd been teaching there for four years at Baylor. And we were on our way to Europe for the summer, for a summer study. So we're driving with friends who were going with us, we came through, I was interviewed that afternoon by Rena Calhoun, by Chancellor Leonard Smith. And in the course of that interview, which went quite charming, he really conducted it because she had recommended him to me. And he was announced that as of that morning, their art department in the, in the form of the one person that was, had resigned.Glen Taul
7:00Oh
Orlin Corey
8:00So, he interviewed Irene on the spot, the next hour while I was given a tour of
the campus. We were both offered the jobs before we left, and we signed and left Georgetown with contracts to start teaching here that fall. Now, that's a long, unexpected answer.Glen Taul
9:00My goodness. You mean, so you never did meet the president before you were hired--
Orlin Corey
10:00No I never met Dr. Hill until I arrived in September.
Glen Taul
11:00And what was your impression of him?
Orlin Corey
12:00Oh, he's fine. A very much a--a Virginia Pparson, I don't mean that in a
derogatory sense, but in a formal sense, almost Episcopal sense of presence about himself and certainly Baptists too, but I mean, very reserved and imposing appearance and good voice and was very aware of the social amenities of the world--that was quite clear in the way the table was set, the way they talk--went and the way everything was. But Chancellor Smith had the responsibility for employing--Glen Taul
13:00Is that right?
Orlin Corey
14:00--Or did at that time?
Glen Taul
15:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
16:00I can not speak before that moment, but that's how I met him.
Glen Taul
17:00And then What year was this?
Orlin Corey
18:001952.
Glen Taul
19:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
20:00So in September, we came here, excuse me--
Glen Taul
21:00Oh, no, that's alright.
Orlin Corey
22:00--In very early September and moved into an apartment on Military street
upstairs above where? Coleman?--Arnold lived.Glen Taul
23:00Is that right?
Orlin Corey
24:00So there began a long friendship. Yeah.
Glen Taul
25:00And what were you hired to do? Now, you were hired by in--the--in the speech department.
Orlin Corey
26:00It was the speech department.
Glen Taul
27:00And I know Mrs--go ahead--
Orlin Corey
28:00Well Rena Calhoun was--was the speech department.
Glen Taul
29:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
30:00However they had, it grown to the point that they had a debate person and Mrs.
Dorothy Melzer was very capable, very capable with them did a superb job with it. And these things had--ahd naturally grown, it's the history of the speech world, that they came out of English, used to be English in speech, then speech appeared. This is in the history of that bit of the academic world. And then the drama, if it was allowed, either started in English as a literary study, and sometimes crept out onto stage and began in this case, it came through speech. So, in the course of time, in '54, this had become a Speech and Drama Department, which meant instead of the, the speech major having one or two drama courses, the speech and drama major had courses of both kind of a hybrid and a perfectly compatible mix.Glen Taul
31:00Yeah. Yeah.
Orlin Corey
32:00And so Dorothy Melzer was already there. And the student radio station had just
started, but this was really student operated, but was under the general supervision of the speech department. I was brought in to help be technical assistant in doing the plays, which she would direct. And I believe they had directed two plays a year at that time and Lewis Auditorium was a very new facility, then even Giddings Hall--been there maybe a couple of years by then as a stage.Glen Taul
33:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
34:00And so I was brought in for that purpose, and would also teach some basic
courses. And then a stagecraft course, came with that, which was a new course coming with me.Glen Taul
35:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
36:00And then I was, I sought permission to direct in a different way--to direct a, a
play, that would be toured to churches, which seemed to be a logical extension from a Georgetown College Speech Department. This was allowed, and then also to form a community-based children's theater, using the college students to help lead them. So in that sense, I became involved in from the beginning, in some of the drama side, but I came as a speech teacher with that responsibility.Glen Taul
37:00Oh. Okay. How did you teach speech--at that time? What method or approach did
you take? Was it lecture? Was it engaging the students in interaction in the class?Orlin Corey
38:00It was--yes, it was basically, it was rooted in the well, historically--in the
old Greek sense of rhetoric.Glen Taul
39:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
40:00Certain objectives and clarity and research and facts. But, constantly on the
challenge of they would give a speech, a theme would be announced, and they would prepare a two, three, four, hardly ever more than five minutes speech in that particular take on that particular subject. As such as the cliche of the time would be, what I did on my summer vacation.Glen Taul
41:00Yeah. Yeah.
Orlin Corey
42:00It could start from there. But then as their interests appeared, and the whole
sense of the logic and preparation of this, of, of the of the speeches worked, speeches of persuasion, speeches of information, speeches of those categories were developed. So it was constantly a theory and then practice on their part. As I recall, it's been some years since I did this, I did this for several years. I think with me, in the course of the semester, they did eight speeches.Glen Taul
43:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
44:00And--which kept them pretty busy as these kept growing and requirements.
Glen Taul
45:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
46:00Somewhat research topics, obviously, connecting back again to the library and so
forth. So that was a gentle approach on the--on the speech, then oral interpretation would be another side of this, which is simply, what it implies, reading aloud.Glen Taul
47:00Was that a new feature in the 50s?
48:00Wel--no, no, no, that--that really came out of the old schools of rhetoric. And
at one time, was called expression in the 1880s and 90s, just before I was born. I can persuade some people now I remember when that was. [laughter] And they believe me, which is more startling, they--the joke disappears. But that--the infusion of that side, which is clearly a child of, ultimately of public speaking, and but also the stage. So here we are, the analysis of literature. And how do we present this effectively to an audience, beyond our own research and background? Something I personally continue doing constantly.Glen Taul
49:00Don't they call this--
Orlin Corey
50:00--About to do this.
Glen Taul
51:00Don't they call that oral interpretation? Yeah,
Orlin Corey
52:00Well, at that time, it was called, it was expression in the 19th century, it
became oral interpretation and the courses were called, or interpretation courses,Glen Taul
53:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
54:00And usually to something called Interp, in the vernacular.
Glen Taul
55:00Yeah--
Orlin Corey
56:00--To interpret one and two--
Glen Taul
57:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
58:00--And then you could have advanced and the full title of catalog (??) would be
oral interpretation,Glen Taul
59:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
60:00To make the distinction between the written and the--
Glen Taul
61:00And this might be--include poetry or
Orlin Corey
62:00--Poetry
Glen Taul
63:00---Or diagloue--
Orlin Corey
64:00--Rrhetoric, possibly dialogue, your raw materials would be any any literary
form that was meant to be shared aloud. That would be poetry. Public Address, I mean Webster, Daniel Webster, Lincoln, Wilson, all the material, Gladstone in the history of that, and then in more recent times, Roosevelt and Churchill and so forth. And so that would be part of and many would be--lawyers were advised and took, often to great advantage, then they would often shift over to the debate side, which have--also had some courses. So there, they got to do it, which I think was wonderful for them to do.Glen Taul
65:00Now, today, they have a whole--the whole thing is called forensics?
Orlin Corey
66:00--Yes, yes. Or whatever. Or communication today.
Glen Taul
67:00Yeah, that's the big umbrella.
Orlin Corey
68:00But, that's the current umbrella--is communication skills--department or whatever.
Glen Taul
69:00Here--it's called Communication Arts.
Orlin Corey
70:00Okay. All right.
Glen Taul
71:00Which, under that umbrella, you've got drama, you've got speech, you've got debate.
Orlin Corey
72:00You probably have television now--
Glen Taul
73:00Television.
Orlin Corey
74:00--And film--cinema. Yeah. Which also crept in through basically, again, out of
the old theater, really, the acting out or the showing forth of what the ideas are called. Now, this is all--what has happened at Georgetown is, is root and branch of the history of these fields as they've evolved through the country. There wasn't anything distinctive about the way it appeared here, they were simply following the practice of the time.Glen Taul
75:00Well---when you came here, at what stage of development--Georgetown.
Orlin Corey
76:00It was just the speech department at that time.
Glen Taul
77:00Okay. So--
Orlin Corey
78:00It was free of English. It was--it had come out of English here.
Glen Taul
79:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
80:00Which is in the in the great in the tradition, whether it's great or not the
tradition of that field.Glen Taul
81:00Of course, in the 19th century, the curriculum was rhetoric.
Orlin Corey
82:00That's right.
Glen Taul
83:00I mean, it was--and rhetoric was infused in every subject.
Orlin Corey
84:00Of course. Yes. And classes were taught that way.
Glen Taul
85:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
86:00But eventually, other approaches evolved, simply because there's room for them,
and there's no need for them. But anyway, in the course of that time, then the drama, the radio, moved into that, just as then the television subsequently did. As did the--Glen Taul
87:00You want me to get you some water?
Orlin Corey
88:00I think I'm okay at the moment. Thank you. Anyway, so I was involved in that
side, but also, the art interpretation courses, the fundamentals of speech course, or public speaking, one, or I forget how they termed it at the time. And I was doing that level than the stagecraft. And then a year or so then there was a beginning acting class. And after a couple of years, it moved on to be accepted as a speech and drama approach. So, a few more courses were added, and the major could do a pretty good balance of all of them. Or could also lean more now, let's say on the debate and the forensic side, or lean more toward the oral interpretation, the stage side, they had three choices.Glen Taul
89:00Was what, from your judgment? Was Georgetown behind the trends or was it in the
middle of the trend? Or was it--why you--I'm--Orlin Corey
90:00My impression is it was very much in the the general movement of that part of
the field, across the country, in terms of its reputation, and work. What I mean in the general movement was, the way it was structured. It was very much in what went on it was in the way that went on then.Glen Taul
91:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
92:00But, in the practice--the debate people, of which was certainly true at Baylor
in my background there were terrific, and had high reputation and in the state and the region. And often, you know, they could take on Ohio State or Indiana University or whatever, as equals. But, certain teams in certain times could do this. So the size of what you came from wasn't necessarily proof that you will be better than the people that came from a little, a little place. And that achievement was also true in it became true on the drama side, in the 50s, but in several different ways. And so the drama programs in the state in the 50s in the colleges, the University of Kentucky. Let's see, University of Louisville had some but not as much. It was all--a little more. But and but Centre [College] and Transylvania tended to be about the same scale of things for the drama side. But in the 50s, all of them grew that way into more activity. There was a statewide festival at that time, that they University of Kentucky sponsored for plays.Glen Taul
93:00Oh, for plays.
Orlin Corey
94:00And specifically shifted it then to Shakespeare productions and would have a
Shakespeare Festival and the Georgetown production that--Rena Calhoun had started the annual Shakespeare several years before that time. About four years before, and the spring I was there, it was as you, like it, was chosen by her here. And she became, and small wonder, ill that winter. It was a time of much flu and so forth that particular season, and she had her duties as she--she was forming a Dean of Women too.Glen Taul
95:00Right.
Orlin Corey
96:00And she had just stepped up, but she was still involved.
Glen Taul
97:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
98:00She lived in Rucker Hall, there was no way go--to escape the fact that I'll go
see Mrs. Rena about this or that. A well as the speech department, and so forth. And so I stepped in at her request, it was necessary to to finish directing that play. And then we took it to the University of Kentucky. So I had an intimate sense of how to do--what we did. We had a--we had three weeks to rehearse, she had a two week start, and we had three additional weeks to bring it together. And though nobody officially judged who, who was best, the audience reaction was overwhelming. The Georgetown production was the best received. I'm sorry to say the university stopped having that that year.Glen Taul
99:00Oh. [laughter]
Orlin Corey
100:00Many years later, when I'm directing the American College Theatre Festival from
the Kennedy Center, we saw the same thing happening. If--in the festival in regions, a smaller college would beat say the University of Washington--Glen Taul
101:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
102:00--Or Yale.
Glen Taul
103:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
104:00No Yale, no University of Washington the next year. Because after all, the right
talent at the right moment--Glen Taul
105:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
106:00--Can go anywhere. The song--of acting or speaking, it's obviously true. It
hurts the reputation of those who--Glen Taul
107:00About what year was that? When all this---
Orlin Corey
108:00Well, this as you like, it was in that first year--that was this--
Glen Taul
109:00--In '53?--
Orlin Corey
110:00--The winter of 1953. I came September of '52.
Glen Taul
111:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
112:00Right. And all of that helped both Centre and it helped Transylvania and
Georgetown to help justify more activity on the state side.Glen Taul
113:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
114:00They were beneficial. I don't mean in any way to, to, to deny with that little
laugh, but this did not have meaning at the university, of definitely did. It was very good for them to do this. They did it for several years.Glen Taul
115:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
116:00That was the last year they did it though.
Glen Taul
117:00Okay. So you've made--now is this--when Mrs. Calhoun was sick and--and you step
in to help her. Did you--did your responsibilities start increasing if regard to the maskraftersOrlin Corey
118:00Well, I had to direct that play.
Glen Taul
119:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
120:00My requirements were with that--.
Glen Taul
121:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
122:00Specifically that play.
Glen Taul
123:00That play.
Orlin Corey
124:00And theoretically, the same relationship continued the next year and that she
directed the two mainstage plays. But by then, the touring play had come about, which I've just alluded to.Glen Taul
125:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
126:00In that '52-53 year, which went extensively and was well received. So much so,
this became--must have become an annual feature. And that piece would be staged on the campus first, which became a third major production. So in effect, the maskrafters had two directors at that time.Glen Taul
127:00Oh, okay.
Orlin Corey
128:00In the beginning, the concept of the church play was not so much--it was just
another activity would be directored.Glen Taul
129:00It was almost like an outreach tool--
Orlin Corey
130:00Right, it was an outreach concept, but that was a very good thing for many
reasons, very good for students. Because they would, they would have an experience quite different from six intense weeks on a major production here on the campus, and then put it behind them, they would have let us say, because these are shorter plays, maybe four intense weeks of rehearsal, and then they would have to revive it in different places, about every two or three weeks for six months. It was a real experience. And I'm convinced that some of the remarkable people that appeared through that time really grew because they had that challenge on top of their other challenges in the department in debate or another place, because there was time to grow and to learn things about themselves and about the audience and about the craft.Glen Taul
131:00And the way the curriculum was set up at that time, were most all the students
have to participate in some way in the speech or speech curricula?Orlin Corey
132:00Well, I think there wasn't a requirement that people take, oh, there was a
requirement that everyone on campus take a drama appreciation course. That was also in the beginning, there were like four sections of that. So I did two of those. And then the next year did three of them. After that I did all in addition to, you know, the beginning speech course, in addition to and see see how the load would go on, and I'm not complaining, it was pleasant. But casting in plays, then was campus wide, it was not limited to the department. Okay. And I don't know if they can continue that here or not, not. Noqw, the fashion today is to not do that. But I think it's a wonderful thing, to bring in the football player to do something if he wants to. And sometimes he's great with--Glen Taul
133:00--I'm not aware of it being done that way today.
Orlin Corey
134:00It's--the tendency now it's a little like, departments of music evolved, so that
those [who] are in their ensembles, are studying in there. That which is very nice--Glen Taul
135:00I know that Centre College, I have attended plays there. They will, at certain
times they might draw in, like if they need kids parts. So they'll draw in community, kids.Orlin Corey
136:00Yeah, from the community.
Glen Taul
137:00Or they might draw--sometimes they might draw in somebody from the community,
invite somebody.Orlin Corey
138:00We did some of that for the same reason, for small children. But, there was a
tradition here again, and this was Ms. Rena's is doing and wise, it's a very savvy, crafty, foxy, charming lady. [laughter] She'd been here a while she understood lots of things. When she did the Shakespeare, she, she first started, the first Shakespearean play would have been done here. Which what's the well--they made the--the they established the new tradition in. That first year we had a tradition and sustained it. And I think it went on--I don't know, maybe seven or eight years until I left and then I'm not sure. There was one then--thing it probably became an occasional thing. But in any case, in the very beginning, she learned that Dr. George Redding, who was one of the original maskrafters in 1924, and loved Shakespeare, and loved the stage. He came over and he played Polonius in that first Hamlet production.Glen Taul
139:00Oh!
Orlin Corey
140:00And so he played a part in every one of those. And then, as you like it, he
played Jacques. You know, he'd pretty much pick his part. [laughter[ And so you had--had a sense of age casting and that--which was terrific for the college student to work with. Because he and such others--a few others would appear too. When the Importance of Being Earnest was the first production of the maskrafters in 1924.Glen Taul
141:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
142:00And that was started by a man named--Professor James or Jimmy Moreland. And his
widow was alive at that time and lived in what was then called faculty apartments across the street from--it may still be there. I just don't know what's around now, fifty years after this time.Glen Taul
143:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
144:00But, Mrs. Moreland, we made a point of meeting her and talking with her and
inviting her to mass crafter events. And when we got to that '54 production and the (??) of course did that again, they had revived this every 10 years. And the tradition was that every 10th year which they started, the first time it was 10 years old was in '34. The one who had played maybe Cecily or somebody else in that, came back 10 years and played Lady Bracknell and the one in '34 was Lady Bracknell in '44. And that lady came back--Mrs. Marchman (??) I think her name was--in '54. And played the role again. So, there was some of that tradition here always, which is, I think, a very rich kind of thing to do for a department of this size.Glen Taul
145:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
146:00And so yes, we had a some of the age side, but what I meant is, the open
casting, we would announce a Shakespeare play ,and anybody on the campus could come audition, it was not limited to majors or minors in the department.Glen Taul
147:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
148:00And that is no longer quite the practice, in many departments. They tend to be
more like the schools of music now that way. But the advantage is that department reached out by those events into all of those different houses. It--it helped change an attitude.Glen Taul
149:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
150:00All the dorms, it wasn't just a group of people, the drama clique, going around
like this, you know.Glen Taul
151:00Yeah, yeah.
Orlin Corey
152:00It was--everybody was involved. And on one occasion, when we were doing--I
forget which of the Shakespeare plays it was, it may have been the Macbeth, we asked the--all the boys to grow beards. For many reasons, it saved makeup time, but it's also great advertising. [laughter] And it was it was a batch. They even got talked against in some in the letters to the editor. By these people [laughter] these--knows brotherhood types to use a reference to Baylor.Glen Taul
153:00Oh, yeah.
Orlin Corey
154:00It was like--oh they wouldn't use that phrase here, but it was the--same implication.
Glen Taul
155:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
156:00What's going on here, you know. [laughter] The age of crew cuts and they're
growing beard a down here and had crew cuts up here. But anyway, it made a great stage picture.[laughter] So it worked through the campus. I very much believe in that.Glen Taul
157:00Yeah, it's kind of neat. Like. What--tell me more about the church plays. Is
this where you develop, like the Book of Job?Orlin Corey
158:00Well, ultimately, that grew out of that phenomenon. The concept was to do a play
that was always meant to be mobile. In other words, it'd be costumes and actors and not sets.Glen Taul
159:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
160:00And so it could be staged with a minimum of difficulty here and budget was ever
a problem.Glen Taul
161:00Right.
Orlin Corey
162:00Incidentally, Ms. Calhoun had seen to it, probably Professor Moreland before
her. I never knew him, he was dead, before I came along. But the maskrafters has always had their own funds That is, they had to make them. But they were administered by their student officers. And I could still hope that's true. But I daresay some administrators have been wise enough to stop that.Glen Taul
163:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
164:00There's a wisdom, the other words, a great wisdom in doing it, though, because
it's their money, and they work for it and use it better. And so it's their money that's invested to stage the next play. So they tend to be very responsible about it, and work extra hard to make it work. Anyway, we had very little money for a new piece like this, because we were planned only for two plays in here. So it was done very lightly, budget wise. And that particular first production was called Job. As a matter of fact, and it was a version adapted by Amy (??) at the time and she had done this 20 years before, in Michigan, and then here and there. And I was familiar with that. And we staged that. And we did it mostly in old rags that were dyed, nice colors. And, and a little simple platform smaller than this table. A few steps that we could move in a trailer and then take to church and set on a lectern, not a lectrern, but on the platform.Glen Taul
165:00Right.
Orlin Corey
166:00And, and then a few portable lights, which was difficult to manage at the time,
but with a budget in the background, we were able to do this. And we started this by notifying, I think we went to, I don't remember, maybe the registrar at the time. Fully (??) Schneider possibly, and said, "what towns or cities or are there churches that you think might be interested in, you know." And these young people were from certain places, too, which automatically meant certain possibilities were open. And if a church could manage this, and what they had to do was pay for the travel.Glen Taul
167:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
168:00Of the--in that case, I think it was a caravan of four cars and trailer.
Glen Taul
169:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
170:00Four cars and a trailer. About 25 people and the trailer for the platform. And
this and that--could put us up overnight on the Saturday night because we could hardly travel the day, when you think of the size of the state.Glen Taul
171:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
172:00Do it and come back again.
Glen Taul
173:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
174:00So, spend the Saturday night in their congregation, however, they housed us. So,
they'd put us up and feed us. And they paid our expenses. And there was a nominal royalty for the play maybe $20 a performance. Whatever it was Lumus (??) asked at the time. Is what we paid for it.Glen Taul
175:00I mean for the whole church to pay that twenty dollars.
Orlin Corey
176:00Yea, so, they would they would be responsible for the travel of the troop, the
hospitality and putting them up in whatever, that might be $100 or $200 for the church total.Glen Taul
177:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
178:00You know. Yeah, well, it was this item, at that time. But by word of mouth in
the first three months, this began to take off to the point we had to start saying no and being very selective because we didn't want to go more often than every three weeks.Glen Taul
179:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
180:00As a real pusher, and particularly when--we we're going to Paducah.
Glen Taul
181:00Oh!
Orlin Corey
182:00On the roads of the time.
Glen Taul
183:00Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Orlin Corey
184:00No--no interstates.
Glen Taul
185:00Two lane roads--hardly ever.
Orlin Corey
186:00And we were invited to Indianapolis.
Glen Taul
187:00Oh, yeah.
Orlin Corey
188:00Cincinnati, all in the first year. And because I had some contacts in Waco, and
in Texas and had developed a program within a large church of drama, which was both drama secular and drama religious. It had both sides to it, for recreation and for worship purposes. It was very easy. And I did, we set up a tour down there at the end of spring. So we all took off down that a-way for 10 days and played in Houston and played in Austin and played in Dallas and Waco and Oklahoma City. Listen, they were hooked. [laugher] We all--we all were exhausted, but also great experience. Well now, think at the size of the campus. People kept coming, they wanted to be involved. The next year we did a very small play. We did Christopher Fry's A Sleep of Prisoners Okay well anyway--we did the--we did that piece in the chapel. Because the--the--the soldiers are captured by an enemy. And it's their dreams at night, which are biblically connected, related they're Cain and Abel, David and Absalom, so quite--a quite a beautiful piece. And that piece went so well that we really had a third on campus major production. It ran two weekends in the chapel, and thus did not interfere with those auditoriums. And the plans for the fall there. Made some money, which helped--helped all sides, you know, including the program got to know us and real advantages to that attitude. And then I had a little caucus with Ms. Calhoun, we decided, well maybe better do a play for touring to churches, because it developed that one of these fellows really couldn't travel.Glen Taul
189:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
190:00And because he had a church. He was a religion major. And he had a church, Bill
Parsons by name. Oh, so we did every man, back to four cars and a trailer and about 20 people and I did a version of that. And again, we had to hold this down as to how often we went. And then subsequently, year by year, there would be a major on campus production in the chapel, which meant I was choosing pieces that matched, that fit.Glen Taul
191:00That--that site.
Orlin Corey
192:00--That fit that venue? Yes, Dorothy Sayer's "The Zeal of Thy House." Not well
known here but was a second play at the Canterbury Festival in the 30s. About William Hassan's, who started Canterbury Cathedral. Oh, and so it's that story.Glen Taul
193:00That sounds like an interesting one.
Orlin Corey
194:00An interesting one in that chapel with two Archangels who worked from the
balcony up above. They had great ladders that they descend. It was something to learn to descend it forward, you know, as they were talking and soforth.Glen Taul
195:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
196:00And interesting piece and it worked like a charm. It ran to I think it was six
nights to a Thursday, Friday, Saturday.Glen Taul
197:00And there was another major play going in--
Orlin Corey
198:00Not at the same time--
Glen Taul
199:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
200:00But, it would be a building or rehearsing or.
Glen Taul
201:00Oh, right.
Orlin Corey
202:00Budgetary considerations and space were problems.
Glen Taul
203:00Right.
Orlin Corey
204:00And we didn't throw that one (??) So we started doing one on campus.
Glen Taul
205:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
206:00And and then we would do one for touring.
Glen Taul
207:00Now what--now What year was this taking place?
Orlin Corey
208:00Well-
Glen Taul
209:00--When that developed--
Orlin Corey
210:00'53. Well, you see, this grew out of the "Job", which was '52-53-'53-'54 and
then '54-'55 and we had to use leave in England, from June of '55 to September '56. And things down shifted a bit. But it came back with big force. They kept the Shakespearean play, they kept a number of things going. And by then Lewis Auditorium was doing I think three or four productions a year, which is about enough. When you have no space to build thingsGlen Taul
211:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
212:00I mean, it's complicated.
Glen Taul
213:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
214:00Everything you did had to be done on that stage.
Glen Taul
215:00So, Wilson Auditorium was constructed when you came here?
Orlin Corey
216:00It was here before I came--
Glen Taul
217:00--Just be--
Orlin Corey
218:00--Just before I came.
Glen Taul
219:00Just before you came, so it was practically new.
Orlin Corey
220:00Yes, that adaptation was practically new and then we the maskrafters, who had a
lot of autonomy, we thought, you know, have our own money.Glen Taul
221:00Right.
Orlin Corey
222:00Decided we need--need to make some improvements in ther.
Glen Taul
223:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
224:00As we did need to. And so with student help, and we had some students who knew
metalwork. Using our own money, we put in a lighting board on the side on pipes and went up. So you have a second floor over here off stage. It wasn't as big as this table, the whole platform we built up so people can work on it, and the door could open and leave with a good work above on the lights, which says I'm standing over here in the middle of everything.Glen Taul
225:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
226:00Because the platforms made for speech, really. And this gave it a chance. And
then up above is the chemistry department, which sometimes it'd leak strange smelling things through the floor. [laughter] And so in front of the audit out in front they had that, we took a saw, we knew how the beams ran.Glen Taul
227:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
228:00And cut--and they were widely space, just from one beam all the way across
because of greater beams.Glen Taul
229:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
230:00--To the next one. And then put in pipework to hold lights and wired it
Glen Taul
231:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
232:00So we had a front beam, which was essential otherwise, you couldn't get any
light in anybody's face until the inside picture frame. This way, you had great light, they could--we could build out to the auditorium for a small extension, which is great for (??). We did all of this this on our own hook? And one day, just when we sawed through the--the hole this way? Brad Jones who was, you know, more or less I guess he was a business manager then. And walking through and he had--he was apapletic--poor Brad. [laughter] You know, "what's going on--you're wrecking this building who's behind this (??) court?" You know [sighs] Well, we were so far into it, we had to go ahead and do it.Glen Taul
233:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
234:00And it was the club's money and the work was being you know, it was--it was
initiative, it was the way they build the building, I'll bet you originally, but this was 1954. And that would have been 1829--or '30. [laughter]Glen Taul
235:00It was 1841.
Orlin Corey
236:00Okay, '48 or what.
Glen Taul
237:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
238:00It was a big difference. Anyway, we modified it, and then changed the seats. We
took out--unbolted to make a little center aisle. So you'd have to walk all the way through all of these narrow seats. You had a center space, we lost maybe 24 seats that we've gained about 18 of them back because we came close to the front.Glen Taul
239:00I see.
Orlin Corey
240:00So, the center outside as and that's the way we left it. I don't know, it's
probably not that way now. It may have been torn out by now. I don't know.Glen Taul
241:00Oh, you mean--
Orlin Corey
242:00Lewis Auditorium.
Glen Taul
243:00Oh yeah, it's the--maybe it's called--the administration building.
Orlin Corey
244:00And so there's no Lewis Auditorium. No, well.
Glen Taul
245:00It's out of there.
Orlin Corey
246:00It wasn't hard to tear it out. I can tell you. [laughter] It was pretty lightly
done. And I don't I mean us, originally, they just laid some risers in for seating. --When they did it. Anyway, that was the home of the maskrafters. But because we also had the other--we claimed the chapel from time to time and got it booked in for always in the autumn before the music program was too well established. As the traffic it allows you across the street. So we got into the building at the right time and got out again.Glen Taul
247:00Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Orlin Corey
248:00So that would do that.
Glen Taul
249:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
250:00But anyway, all of that evolved pretty much in those three years '52, the fall
of '52 through the spring '55.Glen Taul
251:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
252:00And then that program continued to pace when we returned from leave in the fall
of '56. Until Well, I resigned from directing the mass craftors, which was never in my contract, my contract was teach.Glen Taul
253:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
254:00I resigned from that in the fall of '58. For sufficient reason, I think with the
administration. And, and continued teaching through the end of the year to fulfill that part of it. But that program, more or less continued, I'd say to the spring of '59, then it was someone else's responsibility and whatever. I really don't know what happened after that.Glen Taul
255:00Was there--was there ever a feeling on your part of limitations of what kind of
plays you could--Orlin Corey
256:00Well--
Glen Taul
257:00--Produce--
Orlin Corey
258:00-- I was always conscious of where I was. And I didn't disagree with that. But I
also had a very broad sense of the of the material. And you know, some of the Shakespearean plays were a little near the bone for some people, I can tell youn [laughter] Indeed. So I had no sense of--I was just aware of, but I refuse to let everything--well, but inside the parameters that I had recognized, we claimed complete freedom. And when had a little trouble with a little of that occasionally, a very minor rumble twice--that went alright. But I have--I need to answer--finish one question about, you said "Job." The plays that went to churches, caused considerable awareness. And interestingly enough, when we were in Louisville, we were reviewed--interview--reviewed by the--both the Louisville Times and the [Louisville] Courier-Journal. Cincinnati would be reviewed by The Enquirer and so forth. At another time, I don't think they would do that today with plays from colleges, but in the 50s, they did.Glen Taul
259:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
260:00And this was very good for Georgetown. Very good in many ways. And many people
at the college were aware that and I think some were indifferent to that. But obviously people, all kinds of people. But, one of the productions. I think it may have been in a Methodist Church because we played in churches of all denominations. We generally played Baptists because of the connections of our students.Glen Taul
261:00Right.
Orlin Corey
262:00But we also played in Episcopal, Disciples of Christ, Presbyterian, Methodist,
one or two Catholic, one Jewish Temple?Glen Taul
263:00Oh!
Orlin Corey
264:00Sure.
Glen Taul
265:00Interesting.
Orlin Corey
266:00--You bet there's a lot of interest in exchanging a lot of these things. Anyway,
and so that--the program reached beyond the so called parameters. Nobody gave us parameters. So we went where we were invited. But one of the plays was reviewed, when we played in a Methodist Church in Cincinnati, by The New York Times, which was nice. We learned of that about a week after--the review was a week later.Glen Taul
267:00Is that right?
Orlin Corey
268:00It was the instant wire service. Stuff you might have today.
Glen Taul
269:00Right.
Orlin Corey
270:00And I learned of it the week after it came out. You know, it was not--we were
pleased. Now then, fast speed. Irene and I had a years leave to study abroad, left here in early June '55, and came back at the end of August '56. And the shank of that time from mid-September, into June, was in London. And I studied at The Central School of Speech and Drama and she at The Central School of Arts and Crafts and here in there, and she was working in design and cost--historic costume and painting and I was into advanced directing. And was working on a possible book for the field, ultimately decided not to do. I felt--the book had been done.Glen Taul
271:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
272:00After I got through with it. But anyway, I did it. It was good for me. And I
researched this at--other plays at the British Drama League Library, which is the major library, the biggest library of theater work in England, and quite a good one there in Euston Square, in London. And over there I went to establish my credentials and get permission and so forth. And discovered that the executive director of the British Drama League at that time was E. Martin Brown, who was the producer who really had discovered T.S. Eliot and Christopher Fry and later Robert Bolt, as a man for all seasons to name some pieces--Glen Taul
273:00Oh, yes--
Orlin Corey
274:00--People and always interested in drama of religious dimension. And I had
written him for information, I was doing my master's thesis.Glen Taul
275:00Oh.
Orlin Corey
276:00So I had a written sense, I was quite aware who he was. He was there but he
recognized my name and said, "come by and have tea," and I did and we talked and he said you know, "you did quite an interesting play, I read in The New York Times. " Just then he went to his (??) and he pulled this out and he said, "Oh yeah." He-"tell me about that program." Well, out of that came the following. No more details. After--across the next six months, he approached the Religious Drama Society of Britain, which he was the chairman of. And the and because he knew for me, this was from--Baptist related, he went to the English Baptist Union and talked to F--Dr. F. Tombly (??) Lord, which is a great name for ministers, and Dr. Tombly (??) Lord. I love it. A marvelous man and talked to them both. And came to me and said, "If you,"--that is the Georgetown you--Glen Taul
277:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
278:00--"Can create a play to be performed in churches with your college troop and can
bring them to us in the summer of 1958." This was two plus years ahead, when he was talking to me, this is early '56, he's telling me this. Then, the British Drama Society, in combination with the English Baptist Union will help the tour and then the British Drama League, if you will also choose a companion piece for the amateur theatre. So it's (??) amateur theatre.Glen Taul
279:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
280:00They will to about one, and he said, "that preferably should be, of course
Americana." And he said, "ideally probably musical, or of that audience." And it--for the churches, he said, "your own choice, we would recommend you do something biblical when you consider where we're going." And then he said, and "you know, this will be very helpful to us, because it is still against the law in England." They said this in 1956, for plays--biblical plays to be performed in churches.Glen Taul
281:00Is that right?
Orlin Corey
282:00This goes back to the 1500s. You're getting rid of the excesses.
Glen Taul
283:00--Of the Catholic Church.
Orlin Corey
284:00Well--of the church.
Glen Taul
285:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
286:00But the plays of the church.
Glen Taul
287:00Right.
Orlin Corey
288:00The church--be--it was the Catholic, but they threw them out because they were
doing all kinds of things. And things that--Glen Taul
289:00To ban them.
Orlin Corey
290:00Yeah. And they got rid of them. Well, that's still on the statute books, or it
was then.Glen Taul
291:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
292:00And he said, "but in this era of good feeling, and after the Second World War,
and that your're yanks," and he said, "that's fine, because you won't know that and we'll look the other way" [laughter]. And he said, "it will help the precedent, because we need to have the right to do this again." T.S. Eliot's Murder in the Cathedral was never given in a church in England--Glen Taul
293:00I see.
Orlin Corey
294:00--Until the 1970s. Made its way through the theaters and with great success. And
of course, it's magnificent too and it's in a church, or a cathedral setting, ideally. Anyway. So we did all that. And out of that, that's because of the touring. I went back, I spent a year--I wasted a year looking for plays. And most of the plays written for churches are really terrible.Glen Taul
295:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
296:00They're--they're sermons, they're well int--they come from the heart.
Glen Taul
297:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
298:00But like we were talking at lunch today, you know, they, they have so much to
deliver, they can't go anywhere. They're just kind of hung up in that. And so I ultimately did my own version. And this time I went to Job and did my own.Glen Taul
299:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
300:00And used the authorized version was the one we had done originally was modern
English when we toured. But I trusted the multimedia spy, but the modern American versus what we used in 1952. But for this one, we went back to the authorized version, because I knew the English audience would know and love--Glen Taul
301:00They'd recognize it.
Orlin Corey
302:00Yes, the King James language or the authorized version, and we did--and always
did that with the Job after that. And the Job we did was quite a different show than than when we did before.Glen Taul
303:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
304:00The other was in rags and, and kind of Bedouin bright colors, you know, just.
[laughs] And this was highly ritualized and stylized to belong in those beautiful churches.Glen Taul
305:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
306:00Basically, it was chanted and spoken, and declaimed, and so forth. And so that
took two years to develop. And then it was first staged as the annual in the chapel piece that we were doing--Glen Taul
307:00Here
Orlin Corey
308:00In the chapel. And for the homecoming weekend--
Glen Taul
309:00--Okay--
Orlin Corey
310:00--In October, he gave us--scheduled for three performances, I think we held over
to the next weekend and gave a fourth one. And we will continue to shape it. We went on, we took it to the Kentucky General Association, which met in Harlan that year.Glen Taul
311:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
312:00Which is where they passed a very fateful committee thing to do a study and--
Glen Taul
313:00Oh, for the--
Orlin Corey
314:00Yeah.
Glen Taul
315:00--Moving of the colleges and so forth.
Orlin Corey
316:00It was overlapping timelines on these.
Glen Taul
317:00Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Orlin Corey
318:00Because I do believe time is a cure yes.
Glen Taul
319:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
320:00All of these times is spinning you have--
Glen Taul
321:00I know.
Orlin Corey
322:00And we did all of that checking around and revising, and then come the next
spring. That piece, having profited by that and having had the shakedown, was tuned a bit by me and then I chose a cast of five graduates and five promising undergraduates. So we'd have the--Glen Taul
323:00So, it was a cast of ten?
Orlin Corey
324:00It was a cast of ten.
Glen Taul
325:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
326:00And this is where five who had previously graduated, but were extra people, Bill
Parsons, and and so on and so on were brought in. Jenny Champion. And then of the younger people who were on the campus like a Warren Hammock (??) and a Jean Diskey (??) and so forth. So it was blending the experience of both.Glen Taul
327:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
328:00And then we'd rehearse the piece here. Took it to two churches and WHAS
[Louisville TV station] television before we took off for Canada, and eventually-- finally after the Brussels Fair, then were in England for that month.Glen Taul
329:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
330:00And with that, peace we commissioned another piece. Remember, the British (??)
Glen Taul
331:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
332:00--piece.
Glen Taul
333:00Right.
Orlin Corey
334:00A folk piece. Commissioned Jim Peyton (??), who was a graduate from here, a
speech and drama man, and played the Job in the modern language version that went to Texas. He was teaching in this area then, I think he later went to work for the state, at the Department of Education in Frankfort. Now he retired and I think he probably lives around here.Glen Taul
335:00Yeah. Yeah.
Orlin Corey
336:00Anyway, and you may know him, I don't know.
Glen Taul
337:00No.
Orlin Corey
338:00But anyway, Jim did for us his version of John Henry, a musical version, John
Henry, the railroad man. And we did that highly styled with songs, folk songs, and he played the guitar. And was is the singing man who struck that and then B- songs. And John Henry was, you know, he was, the night club flouzies ate him up.Glen Taul
339:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
340:00And all of that. So there was a nightclub scene.
Glen Taul
341:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
342:00And we had a little [makes disapproving noises] had that some of that and the
president of the college at that time well, it was known that the run was over.Glen Taul
343:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
344:00And and then we were going to revive because with fitting in people, experienced
people were coming in to join, so they had to be cast in that, just like they were in the Job. So that was to have a trial production too and we learned the day before that a committee of four trustees were coming to take a look at it to--to close it down and ban the tour.Glen Taul
345:00Oh, really? The John Henry--
Orlin Corey
346:00They had to close down and ban the whole tour. Because the John Henry was going
where it wasn't fitting to be-- represent the college. Okay. So, we just decided it was ready, packed the show and they never saw it.Glen Taul
347:00So, you left before they came?
Orlin Corey
348:00Well, we didn't do the show, we didn't leave till we left. But we didn't do a
public show. We just had another rehersal. You know, closed door work so it--it was a sweet pretty little folk show. And but the Job piece got all the attention, for lots of reasons.Glen Taul
349:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
350:00The other was (??) in a certain tradition of a small, kind of folksy musical.
Glen Taul
351:00Now is--do you think that the--the objections to the John Henry piece by these
trustees is because it involved a Black man?Orlin Corey
352:00No. Oh, no, no, it was first of all, a white cast anyway. You know it--no, it
wasn't that. No, it was--it was the floozies. I would suspect.Glen Taul
353:00The floozies.
Orlin Corey
354:00The floozies. You know, a couple of songs.
Glen Taul
355:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
356:00Felt that (??) were had a fair amount of innuendo in one or two cases. And then
you go on again to the contest of the machine and--Glen Taul
357:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
358:00--And the death of John Henry and.
Glen Taul
359:00Yes.
Orlin Corey
360:00And the whole thing went on through until he takes his hammer and goes on across
into the other place, in the great beyond, so forth. And it was pleasant. It's just that there was a [makes concerned noises] [laughter] And I later learned there was a lot of, but at the time, I'm just telling you all I knew at the time, but that was up at the very top.Glen Taul
361:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
362:00And this particular committee was brought in by instructions, but not admitted
so, to take a look.Glen Taul
363:00You think on the--you know, on the president? Absolutely. Without question. And
this is Dr. Eddleman? [Dr. H. Leo Eddleman]Orlin Corey
364:00Yes, he called me in to try to stop the tour after that. Oh, is that right?
Glen Taul
365:00Now you think he would have had any objections if you just did the Book of Job. And--
Orlin Corey
366:00--Well--
Glen Taul
367:00--And not in
Orlin Corey
368:00--In the visit I've referred, to which I should mention, I was summoned. This
was really before the two shows had been revived again. But they played see the Job had been touring the previous year.Glen Taul
369:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
370:00The usual story for a piece
Glen Taul
371:00Right.
Orlin Corey
372:00And John Henry was the spring show done in early May, ran the two weeks and then
closed out and there were finals. And then we were at the interim, and just bringing back the grads to fit in and re-rehearse both shows.Glen Taul
373:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
374:00Bring them up to leave in about the third week of June is the way we had it.
Glen Taul
375:00Cause you all were going to tour that summer.
Orlin Corey
376:00Yeah, because then we were going via Canada to perform there and then catch a
ship from Montreal. And this is--'58-- --To sail. This is '58. So somewhere at the end of May. I was summoned to the president's office. And Dr. Harris was a dean. And he was seated in chair behind me. I thought that's interesting. And then I was here in New Orleans, and I'm in his place anyway.Glen Taul
377:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
378:00And then he began talking and--
Glen Taul
379:00I'm in the position of the president.
Orlin Corey
380:00Yeah, you're the pres--
Glen Taul
381:00And you were there and---
Orlin Corey
382:00---Back over here just behind, yes. It wouldn't matter, back then--
Glen Taul
383:00It was very cumbersome.
Orlin Corey
384:00I could wish if they had and if I had the tape it'd be fascinating.
Glen Taul
385:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
386:00He proceeded to tell me how ashamed he was with the maskrafters and how
embarrassed he was by them. Then he proceeded to attack the entire program all the way back from the time he'd come. We had done the Tartuffe for example because we did classics. And you know, that's the play about the hypocrite. It was interesting that he--he said he was embarrassed by this. Somewhere. Amalia (??) would have been delighted, I think. [laughter] He was embarrassed but (??) would have been delighted. [laughter] And the Shakespeare really was not fit for mix company. Macbeth is about witchcraft. He had all of the the most narrow reads on things and this and that and they had a gabler, Gibson was an agnostic. It's just astonishing. To listen--I just listened--this went on some time. Maybe 20 minutes. He--I would say he really turned on.Glen Taul
387:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
388:00And--but then the point came about England. He said, "well of course they're
laugh you off the stage in England with that Job." He said, "they--they know about Bedouins, people don't look like that. That's like Catholics." I had none (??) was (??). And of course we had raised our own money, remember the maskraftersGlen Taul
389:00Right.
Orlin Corey
390:00We raised our own money. And the students put up some but it was pretty well
matched for me. I mentioned noon, I sold a car. My Thunderbird, yeah, was part of it.Glen Taul
391:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
392:00And there were others too. Mrs. Alice Fogel (??) did--he did twenty percent of
the cost.Glen Taul
393:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
394:00--For us so, which again, he didn't know.
Glen Taul
395:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
396:00But anyway, so I had no reason they couldn't stop me unless, unless he was to
give me an ultimatum that my job or for the tour and he couldn't do that because I had tenure.Glen Taul
397:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
398:00But then, and then he got into this. Also, but interestingly enough less to me
about that than the Job. "The Job's not Christian," he said. That's interesting, then he's no testament professor. How interesting to separate--Glen Taul
399:00The two books--
Orlin Corey
400:00--The two because--
Glen Taul
401:00It fits.
Orlin Corey
402:00--The two religions are--they're mother and daughter, historically, and in many,
many, many, many ways anyway [laughter]. And on the there was a song in John Henry, which I think three girls were involved in. Who played the three floozies in--there were two scenes. Something about he's a railroad man and he can ride my train anytime.Glen Taul
403:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
404:00Sort of thing.
Glen Taul
405:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
406:00And she did the whole thing quite properly with a nuance. Which was--everybody caught.
Glen Taul
407:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
408:00But isn't it--isn't that where you see people is onstage? That's right, and
well, he did refer to that. But mostly he spent his time about the Job. And he said there you know--there--he said, "there are things in the bible that should be read only in the bathroom or the bedroom."Glen Taul
409:00Now, that's interesting.
Orlin Corey
410:00It was one of his phrases. I remember--certain phrases I clearly remember. And
that they would laugh you off the stage and, and you--you people really should just stay here.Glen Taul
411:00Now by this time--he had been in President six years, right?
Orlin Corey
412:00No, he was present only four years, four and a half years.
Glen Taul
413:00I was trying to get my chronology right.
Orlin Corey
414:00Yeah, he came--he started I believe June 1, '54.
Glen Taul
415:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
416:00And he resigned before Thanksgiving, November '58. So he was about four and a
half years. I guess, that's right.Glen Taul
417:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
418:00Roughly--that's pretty close to it.
Glen Taul
419:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
420:00Maybe four years and--to seven months.
Glen Taul
421:00And by this time, the controversy related to moving--
Orlin Corey
422:00None of this had yet surfaced--
Glen Taul
423:00--About moving the college.
Orlin Corey
424:00No, that would be blowing up in the fall.
Glen Taul
425:00Okay.
Orlin Corey
426:00Because this is all-
Glen Taul
427:00So, this is in May of '58.
Orlin Corey
428:00May of '58, the end of May '58, our tour was the summer of '58.
Glen Taul
429:00But all of this has probably bellowing (??) underneath the surfaces.
Orlin Corey
430:00Oh, no, it definitely I know--I know it was.
Glen Taul
431:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey
432:00I knew--I knew then things were stirring. And because it was not public, it made
one's into straighter. You know, and that's one of the things that was done wrong. Even if the concept might have been a pretty good idea, in theory, the way it was done was so--anyway. That's another matter, but that was prior to that public explosion. That even became public knowledge in Kentucky, when in late August '58, the Courier Journal--Glen Taul 1:
433:00Right.
Orlin Corey 1:
434:00got hold of this, and did a front page story about it, and did several--I
understand. But we just held our own.Glen Taul 1:
435:00So when you're sitting there, and he's talking to you what, what emotions are
going through you?Orlin Corey 1:
436:00Well--
Glen Taul 1:
437:00I know you're sitting there silent and everything.
Orlin Corey 1:
438:00It was such a performance, I was fascinated with him. Because I have lots of
interests, historically, and literary and people and so on. And so all of those things were working. And there just the man back here, I didn't have much to write about because he really wasn't writing unless I talked.Glen Taul 1:
439:00Oh, I see.
Orlin Corey 1:
440:00I have good peripheral vision. They taught me that the Navy--
Glen Taul 1:
441:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey 1:
442:00My eyes are better this way than they are out to the centers today. I still a
good vision this way. So I can really see right--right to there.Glen Taul 1:
443:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey 1:
444:00Anyway, so only when I responded was any note taken, which, again, I understood
what must be happening. I had nothing, particular to say, other than that we're going, people are expecting us. We owe it to people--people in England--people who have given to make it happen, the young people who are going. I said a few things like that.Glen Taul 1:
445:00Yeah.
Orlin Corey 1:
446:00And I'm sorry you cannot wish us well. And--
Glen Taul 1:
447:00Did this strike you--from your historical perspective, of something like the
Inquisition or an English star chamber.Orlin Corey 1:
448:00Well--it's again now something else he disliked was The Crucible we--we staged
The CrucibleGlen Taul 1:
449:00Okay. Arthur Miller?
Orlin Corey 1:
450:00Uh-huh. He didn't like that either. He went through the whole repertoire, he
didn't like one of them. There's one exception, he did not object to one, so I presume he liked it. The one he did not object to was Philip Turner, the English writers' play called Christ in the Concrete City, which is one of the places we toured. And his daughter, his eldest daughter, elder daughter, was in that show. And she did a very good job, the girl was fine. And we played that all over the whole--including Ridgecrest and so forth and so on.Glen Taul 1:
451:00Orlin Corey 1:
452:00But in reference to that general concept, not that play--
Glen Taul 1:
453:00Yeah. --But all the plays he had seen, he was against everyone of them, but did
not mention that one. But there was something wrong with each one. And did he root it in a theological objection or--?Orlin Corey 1:
454:00Well, it was always on a ethical, moral connection. Would you--yeah, oh,
theological without being doctrinally explicit, but it was very much in the manner of The Tartuffe. 455:00