Interview with Susan Sliger

Partial Transcript: And how about to start us off, you just tell me a little bit about yourself in general.

Segment Synopsis: Sliger was born and raised in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Sliger moved to Lexington in 1967 to work at IBM. Sliger describes her upbringing as strict and confining. Sliger's parents were devout Southern Independent Baptists and her family's life revolved around their church. Sliger recalls that she was not allowed to dance, play cards, or swim with the opposite sex. Sliger wanted to get an education and then leave the restrictive environment she was raised in and be herself. Sliger says she spent most of her time outside of school in church, attending church services on Sundays in the morning and evening, and on Wednesday and Thursday nights.

Keywords: IBM; Southern Independent Baptists; LGBTQ+

Subjects: Childhood; Early life; Tennessee; Chattanooga (Tenn.); Parents; Lexington (Ky.); International Business Machines Corporation; Religion; Christianity; Baptists; Gays; Lesbians; Sins; Education; Work; Classmates; Church; Revivals

Partial Transcript: . . . What was school sort of like for you in general?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger went to a fairly large high school, with about three hundred students in her graduating class. Sliger says that the student body was diverse and Silger was also able to connect with gay people for the first time in high school. The first gay person that Sliger met was a high school classmate who then introduced her to other LGBTQ individuals in their school. Sliger went to parties with this new group of friends and had fun, but still dated men in order to please her parents.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Southern Independent Baptists; Expectations; LGBTQ+

Subjects: Education; High school; Chattanooga (Tenn.); Diversity; Classmates; Gays; Lesbians; Religion; Church; Baptists; Guilt; Blacks; African Americans; Parties; Men; Parents; Dating

Partial Transcript: When did you realize sort of like who you were . . .

Segment Synopsis: Sliger began to realize that she was gay during high school, but says that she had feelings for women much earlier in life. Sliger says that she kept these feelings to herself for the most part and only told a select number of trusted friends. Sliger recalls that many of her friends were shocked that she was gay because she had such a strict religious upbringing. Sliger's church was very homophobic, proclaiming that being gay was a sin according to certain bible verses. Looking back on it, Sliger believes that these bible verses were taken out of context and she still identifies as a Christian today.

Keywords: Southern Independent Baptists; LGBTQ+

Subjects: Identity; Sexuality; Gays; Lesbians; Teenagers; High school; Sexual attraction; Shock; Chattanooga (Tenn.); Religion; Church; Baptists; Sins; Bible; Christians

Partial Transcript: . . . You said that you ended up coming out like within that group or somewhere in that time period, I think.

Segment Synopsis: Please note that this segment contains references to sexual abuse and predatory behavior.
Silger says that she came out to her friends as a lesbian when she was fifteen. Silger's first gay relationship was with someone she met in church who was twenty-two. Looking back on it, Sliger feels that she was taken advantage of by this much older woman. Sliger also thinks that this woman was a sexual predator and was not looking for a lesbian relationship, but rather someone who she could abuse. After being together for one and a half years, Sliger's partner broke off the relationship and outed her to her parents. Sliger's parents were angry and grounded her. After this difficult and abusive relationship, Sliger decided that her next relationship would be with a like-minded person who was looking for a long term relationship. Sliger was also even more determined to move away from Chattanooga.

Keywords: Friends; Southern Independent Baptists; Sexual predators; Goals; Outed; LGBTQ+

Subjects: Gays; Lesbians; Teenagers; Chattanooga (Tenn.); High school; Friendship; Church; Baptists; Church; Religion; Dating; Parents; Sexual abuse; Identity; Freedom; Independence; Coming out (Sexual orientation)

Partial Transcript: So, it sounds like . . . for many, many years, you were wanting to get out of this place--um--around what age did that actually happen?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger moved to Lexington to work as a chemical technician for IBM in 1967 when she was twenty-one. Sliger obtained an associates degree in chemical engineering at community college in Chattanooga and was subsequently hired to work at IBM. Moving to Lexington was the first time that Sliger had been on a plane and out of the general vicinity of Chattanooga. Sliger explains that she came from a low-income household and made more money starting out at IBM than her father was earning. Sliger was proud of her accomplishments and wanted to continue to be successful. Silger was able to find the gay community in Lexington purely by instinct, adding that lesbians have a knack for finding one another. Silger began going to The Bar Complex in Lexington and says that she met her life partner of twenty years (Brucie Boyle) at The Country.

Keywords: Moving; LGBTQ+; IBM; Chemical technicians; LGBTQ+; Accomplishments; Instincts; Bars; The Bar Complex (Lexington, Ky.); The Country (Lexington, Ky.); Brucie Boyle

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Education; Chattanooga (Tenn.); Gays; Lesbians; Nineteen sixties; International Business Machines Corporation; Chemical engineering; Community colleges; Airplanes; Travel; Parents; Poverty; Money; Father; Proud; Communities; Dating; Nightlife; Friendship

Partial Transcript: . . . How did you learn that the Country existed, like how did you learn about it?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger says that she found out about The Country because she knew one of the original founders (Ellen Stewart), who also worked at IBM. Sliger also recalls that many people in the Lexington lesbian community were talking about how a lesbian bar was opening. Sliger went to The Country when she was single and tended to not go out when she was in a relationship. Sliger also mentions that her future long term partner was doing plumbing work at The Country in its early years during the late 1970s. Sliger describes the social scene for the Lexington lesbian community in the 1960s and 1970s. Sliger says that most socializing happened in other people's homes. Sliger explains that there was a certain amount of fear surrounding going to places like The Bar Complex. Sliger recalls rumors that police were taking down the license plate numbers of people parked in the alleyway next to The Bar Complex. In-home entertainment primarily consisted of cooking and playing cards. Sliger remembers an overall sentiment in the Lexington lesbian community that it would be nice to have a public space just for lesbians.

Keywords: IBM; Partner; Community spaces; Bars; The Bar Complex (Lexington, Ky.); License plate numbers; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); Ellen Stewart; LGBTQ+

Subjects: Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Nightlife; Lexington (Ky.); International Business Machines Corporation; Dating; Singles; Plumbers; Plumbing; Social; Communities; Safety; Home; Police; Rumors; Playing cards; Cooking

Partial Transcript: Tell me about sort of what a typical night at The Country would be like for you . . .

Segment Synopsis: Sliger describes a typical night at The Country as one filled with dancing, drinking, talking, and playing pool. Silger enjoyed having a place where she could choose different activities to participate in, which was lacking at other bars. Silger says that The Country quickly became the best place to meet a new partner for Lexington lesbians. Silger recalls that about seventy-five percent of the patrons at The Country were women while the other twenty-five percent were by and large gay men. Silger says that most men did not stay the whole night.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); Drinking; The Bar Complex (Lexington, Ky.)

Subjects: Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Nightlife; Lexington (Ky.); Dance; Alcohol; Pool (Game); Talk; Dating; Men; Gay bars

Partial Transcript: Tell me if you can, what you remember about the interior, like the inside of the bar . . .

Segment Synopsis: Sliger describes the interior of The Country. Silger recalls that the bar was the whole length of the main room and that the dance floor was in another room to the right of the bar. Sliger also remembers that there were a few sets of tables and chairs in the main room so people could talk. The dance floor also provided benches and a limited number of tables. Silger says that The Country mostly played disco music and remarks that she does not remember if there was a restroom specifically for men at The Country. Sliger did not take any photos at The Country primarily because it was uncommon to carry around a camera in the days before cell phones. Sliger adds that it would have been strange to bring a camera into a bar. Drinks at The Country mostly consisted of beer and wine rather than mixed drinks. Silger says The Country closed around 1:00 AM and she often held after parties in her van. Sliger went mostly on the weekends, but thinks that The Country was open from around Wednesday through the weekend. In terms of the crowd at The Country, Silger says there were mostly regular customers rather than new people attending. Silger describes the typical pattern of The Country patrons, who would stop going when they found a partner and returned when they broke up.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); Layout; Interiors; Dance floor; Bars; Closing time; After parties; Cars; Regular customers

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Atmosphere; Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Restrooms; Men; Women; Dance; Rooms; Tables; Benches; Music; Disco music; Cameras; Photographs; Alcohol; Beer; Wine; Nightlife; Dating; Singles; Crowds

Partial Transcript: I'm assuming you're familiar with the whole sort of like butch femme thing and all of that?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger says that the concept of butch and femme in lesbian culture was more prevalent in the past than it is today. Butch and femme in the lesbian community is the idea that some lesbian women identify with traits associated with traditional conceptions of masculine (butch) or feminine (femme) expressions of gender identity. Silger says that she never identified with the whole concept of butch and femme, preferring to not use labels on herself or others. Sliger explains that people would try to label her, but when dating she focused on her partner's personality rather than perceived labels. Silger and her long term partner were both against using labels.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Partner; Brucie Boyle

Subjects: Identity; Gays; Lesbians; Labels; Butch and femme (Lesbian culture); Personality; Gender

Partial Transcript: . . . Tell me more about just like that time that you met, like what that was like?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger says that she met her life partner at The Country. Sliger's life partner was helping with some plumbing issues at The Country (since her father owned a plumbing supply business, she was very knowledgeable about plumbing.) Sliger ended up driving her partner home on their first date. Sliger says that they met in 1982 and she had been going to The Country since it opened in 1978.

Keywords: Partner; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); LGBTQ+; Brucie Boyle

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Meeting; Plumbers; Plumbing; Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Nightlife; Dating

Partial Transcript: Something else people have mentioned is that later sort of toward the very end of The Country's existence that the owner changed and that the name changed to The Hidden Door--

Segment Synopsis: Silger says that The Country had its name changed to The Hidden Door when the original owners, who were in a relationship, split up and no longer wanted to run the business together. Silger says that the Lexington lesbian community lost a lot when The Country closed, especially a place where people could date and meet partners. Sliger thinks that The Country closed in part because once couples met there, they decided not go to back. Sliger and her partner began to host Kentucky Derby parties several years after The Country closed in order to revive the sense of community cultivated by The Country.

Keywords: Owners; LGBTQ+; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); The Hidden Door (Lexington, Ky.); Ellen Stewart; Relationships; Community spaces; Partner

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Nightlife; Jealousy; Women; Money; Singles; Communities; Loss; Parties; Kentucky Derby

Partial Transcript: I've gotta tell ya, our parties were pretty famous.

Segment Synopsis: After The Country closed, Sliger and her partner wanted to do something to bring the Lexington lesbian community together. In the mid-1990s, Sliger and her partner began hosting Kentucky Derby parties, in which hundreds of people from the Lexington lesbian community would come to Sliger's farm to reconnect and have fun. Siliger also held fundraisers along with the party, donating thousands of dollars to charitable organizations like AVOL (a charity for people with HIV/AIDS) and to people who had cancer. Sliger says that the party spread by word of mouth and mostly women attended. Silger adds that the party became so well-known that some celebrities and politicians came. Sliger and her partner continued to host the derby party until 2002, when Sliger's partner passed away from cancer. Sliger says that someone else in the lesbian community who owns a farm picked up on the derby party tradition. Sliger's church is planning to hold a twenty year reunion in 2022 in honor of the original derby parties hosted by Sliger.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Derby parties; AVOL Kentucky; Fundraising; Drinks; Brucie Boyle; The Country (Lexington, Ky.)

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Gays; Lesbians; Parties; Kentucky Derby; Farms; Crowds; Money; Charity; Cancer; Food; Jessamine County (Ky.); Women; Men; Celebrities; Politicians; Political campaigns; Death; Episcopal Church; Reunions

Partial Transcript: I go to the Episcopal Church of the Resurrection.

Segment Synopsis: Sliger briefly describes her involvement in her church, The Episcopal Church of the Resurrection in Nicholasville, which she has been a member of since the 1980s. Sliger says that it was rare to have live music at The Country, but many people in the Lexington lesbian community would go to other nightlife spots such as The Fishnet in Lexington to watch the Reel World String Band. Sliger explains why The Country instituted a membership card system. This change was precipitated by issues at The Bar Complex, a gay bar in Lexington which had people harassing bar patrons. Sliger says that laws at the time provided private clubs with the power to turn away patrons who did not have a membership card. Sliger says the owners of The Country wanted to protect their patrons from any kind of harassment issues.

Keywords: The Country (Lexington, Ky.); LGBTQ+; Church of the Resurrection (Nicholasville, Ky.); Reel World String Band; The Fishnet (Lexington, Ky.); The Bar Complex (Lexington, Ky.); Owners

Subjects: Nicholasville (Ky.); Lexington (Ky.); Episcopal Church; Episcopalians; Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Nightlife; String bands; Disco; Private clubs; Safety; Danger; Protection; Membership; Membership cards

Partial Transcript: The Country closes . . . sometime during the 90s is when you start doing this like annual party thing. What--what happens in between those points, just in your life in general like are you still working for IBM, are you doing something different--.

Segment Synopsis: Sliger stayed at IBM for thirty-three years and continued living in Lexington after The Country closed sometime in the 1980s. Sliger missed having a lesbian bar in town and often went with her friends to lesbian bars in Louisville and Cincinnati. Sliger recalls that the lesbian bar in Cincinnati had drag shows. Sliger says she knew two people who were drag performers, one of whom did masculine drag.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); IBM

Subjects: Nightlife; Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Gay bars; Lexington (Ky.); Louisville (Ky.); Cincinnati (Ohio); International Business Machines Corporation; Drag shows; Drag Kings

Partial Transcript: Any other places you went to that were just sort of like where you would go to be around people like you, essentially . . .

Segment Synopsis: Before The Country opened, many lesbians went to a bar in the Thomas January Hemp House in downtown Lexington. Sliger recalls that there was a piano player at the bar. Sliger also mentions an oral history project at the University of Kentucky Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History that Sliger and her partner participated in called GLBT Kentuckians Oral History Project.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Bars; Louie B. Nunn Center for Oral History; Partner; Brucie Boyle; GLBT Kentuckians Oral History Project; Thomas January Hemp House (Lexington, Ky.)

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Piano; Oral histories; University of Kentucky; Interviews

Partial Transcript: At The Country did anyone . . . was there any harassment from nor--like just everyday civilians, normal people at The Country or not really?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger briefly mentions that she felt safe at The Country and the membership card system helped to protect bar patrons from harassment. Sliger says that she has kept in contact with several people she met at The Country. Sliger got into a new relationship after her life partner died and subsequently moved to a farm outside of Frankfort. Sliger hosted one small gathering of people who went to The Country at her farm in Frankfort. Sliger's partner then developed Alzheimer's disease and the couple moved to Michigan to be closer to her partner's family. Sliger was her partner's primary caretaker for three years and moved back to Lexington after she passed away. Upon returning to Lexington, Sliger reconnected with some friends from The Country days and began playing cards with them. Sliger says that Lexington has a good lesbian community, and many people are in prestigious positions such as politicians and judges. Sliger adds that it is a diverse community and people truly support each other.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; The Country (Lexington, Ky.); Relationships; Partner; Family; Caregivers; Lexington lesbian community; Reel World String Band

Subjects: Safety; Protection; Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Lexington (Ky.); Membership; Private clubs; Membership cards; Death; Alzheimer's disease; Michigan; Playing cards; Facebook (Electronic resource); Politicians; Communities; Judges; String bands

Partial Transcript: A bunch of us would always go to the . . . women's--uh--festival in Michigan.

Segment Synopsis: Sliger went to the Michigan Womyn's Music Festival three times. Sliger recalls that there was a diverse group of people there and that nudity was common. Sliger says that it was a women's only space and that even women attending the festival with their young sons had to camp in a different part of the festival grounds.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Driving; Brucie Boyle; Partner

Subjects: Gays; Lesbians; Michigan; Michigan Womyn's Music Festival; Music festivals; Diversity; Nudity; Children; People with disabilities; Children; Music; Boys; Recreational vehicles

Partial Transcript: I---I'm so lucky because I've seen us come from a space where we weren't welcome anywhere to a space now that--where we're welcomed most places.

Segment Synopsis: Sliger says that LGBTQ+ individuals went from being not welcomed anywhere to being welcomed in the vast majority of places. Sliger never thought that gay marriage would be allowed during her lifetime. The legalization of gay marriage happened after Sliger's life partner died, but she's not bothered about it because they were both firmly committed to each other. Sliger is happy to see positive changes and more public expressions of LGBTQ+ identity such as pride parades. Sliger is glad that LGBTQ+ people are able to be themselves, which she says is much more healthy from a psychological standpoint.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Brucie Boyle; Commitment; Pride parades, Gay; Downtown

Subjects: Change; Lexington (Ky.); Gays; Lesbians; Communities; Civil rights; Gay rights; Same-sex marriage; Parades

Partial Transcript: . . . Like way back when you came out--um--what did your family think?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger was outed by her first girlfriend, who told her parents after they had been dating for a year and half. Sliger says that her brother believes that she is going to Hell for being gay. Sliger's immediate family was also not supportive of her, especially because of the significant age gap between Sliger and her girlfriend (Sliger was fifteen and her partner was twenty-two.) Looking back on the relationship, Sliger thinks that her first girlfriend was a sexual predator, especially since she went on to marry a man. Sliger went along with the relationship in part because she had a desire to be with older people instead of her peers. Sliger says that her first girlfriend was a member of Hell's Angels and she used to hang around with her friends from that group.

Keywords: Family; Rush Limbaugh; Sexual predators; Age gap; Friends; Outed

Subjects: Coming out (Sexual orientation); Brother; Parents; Chattanooga (Tenn.); Gays; Lesbians; Religion; Church; Sexual abuse; Teenagers; Hell's Angels; Friendship

Partial Transcript: So, what is life like for you now . . . what are you up to now, how do you spend your time?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger is seventy-five and enjoys socializing with people at the Lexington Diner. Sliger also plays dominoes and cards at the Lexington Diner occasionally. Sliger is glad that this project is being undertaken because she believes that it is important to document the history of the LGBTQ+ community. Sliger also expresses the hope that she will never have to go back to hiding her true self from the outside world like she did when she was younger, when being LGBTQ+ was not as accepted as it is now.

Keywords: LGBTQ+; Friends; Lexington Diner (Lexington, Ky.); LGBTQ+ history

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Friendship; Gays; Lesbians; Dominoes; Card games; Restaurants; Gay rights; History

Partial Transcript: When you look back on The Country after all these years and talking about it again, what do you think, what do you feel?

Segment Synopsis: Sliger looks back fondly on her time spent at The Country. Sliger wishes that she had filmed or taken photos of the inside of The Country, since there are so few images of The Country that exist today. Sliger is nostalgic about The Country because that is where she met her life partner, Brucie Boyle. Sliger says that she misses her partner (who passed away from cancer in 2002), but she is happy that she still has memories of her at The Country.

Keywords: The Country (Lexington, Ky.); LGBTQ+; Partner; Brucie Boyle

Subjects: Lexington (Ky.); Gays; Lesbians; Lesbian bars; Photographs; Nostalgia; Memories