Oral History Interview with Marjorie Graves, August 24, 2009

Partial Transcript: I tell you what, why don't you state your name--uh--your branch of service, your length of service and your area of specialty?

Segment Synopsis: Graves served in the U.S. Army Nursing Corps from 1967 to 1972, primarily on the male orthopedic units treating Vietnam War veterans. Graves was always interested in becoming a nurse and entered the Mary & Elizabeth Hospital School of Nursing after high school. Graves was convinced to join the Nursing Corps in part by an Army recruiter who came to her nursing school. Graves also wanted to escape her strict family and stifling home life by going into the Army. Graves' father did not allow her or her two sisters how to drive. Graves also viewed the Army as an opportunity to gain experience in nursing. Graves explains that Army nurses have more autonomy to choose the type of treatments patients receive compared to civilian nurses.

Keywords: Active duty; Army recruiters; Cars; Family; Medication; Nursing school; Second lieutenant; SS Mary & Elizabeth Hospital School of Nursing; Tuition

Subjects: Basic training; Discipline; Education; Father; German; High school; Independence; Kentuckians; Kentucky; Louisville (Ky.); Money; Nineteen sixties; Nurses; Nursing; Orthopedic nursing; Parents; Patients; Sisters; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; United States. Navy; Veterans; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans--United States; Women veterans; World War II

Partial Transcript: List for me--uh--each tour of duty and your particular assignment.

Segment Synopsis: Graves entered basic training at San Antonio, Texas in May of 1968. Graves had an interesting basic training experience that was very different from her initial expectations. Graves was surprised that outside of being taught how to shoot and preparing for jungle-like conditions on their tours of duty, Graves and the other nurses did not receive very much military training. Graves recalls that most of her training was spent in the classroom rather than on the battlefield. Graves adds that she stayed at a hotel due to overcrowding at the military barracks. Graves says that both male and female nurses were treated the same. Graves states that spouses of female personnel were not considered dependents, and that all women were discharged without exception if they became pregnant.

Keywords: Classes; Discharge, Military; Doctors; Medics; Protocols; Tour of duty

Subjects: Basic training; Dependents; Discrimination; Fort Hood (Tex.); Hotels; Housing; Marching; Marriage; Men; Nineteen sixties; Nurses; Nursing; Nursing--Examinations; Pregnancy; Rifles; Salute; San Antonio (Tex.); Uniforms; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Women; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: --Um--so you do your basic training in Texas, and then where is your first assignment?

Segment Synopsis: Upon completing basic training, Graves worked in the orthopedic nursing unit at Fort Hood for about two years before requesting a transfer to Fort Knox in order to be closer to family in Louisville. Graves recalls that there were few beds available in her orthopedic unit at Fort Knox because of the large amount of Vietnam War returnees who had extensive physical injuries.

Keywords: Carl R. Darnall Army Medical Center (Fort Hood, Tex.)

Subjects: Fort Hood (Tex.); Fort Knox (Ky.); Nineteen seventies; Nineteen sixties; Nurses; Nursing; Orthopedic nursing; Transfer; United States. Army; United States. Army--Reserves; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans--United States; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: Did you request to go to Vietnam?

Segment Synopsis: Graves explains that she volunteered to serve in Vietnam in part because of the nature of the Vietnam veterans she treated at the military hospital. Graves admits that she had a vision of herself as a Florence Nightingale figure in Vietnam helping to make a difference in the war. Graves adds that she was appreciative of the American soldiers who were making the ultimate sacrifice to protect their country, with most soldiers taking on this responsibility out of a sense of patriotic duty (since they were drafted into the military). Graves recalls that her head nurse and her family were shocked at her decision to serve in Vietnam voluntarily. In terms of tending to the medical needs of Vietnam returnees, Graves states that they were more humble and appreciative than the typical soldier.

Keywords: Florence Nightingale; National defense; Sacrifices

Subjects: Draft; Father; Freedom; Independence; Medical care; Nineteen seventies; Nurses; Nursing; Orthopedic nursing; Parents; Patriotism; Soldiers; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans--United States; Volunteerism

Partial Transcript: So, how long--once you put in your request, to go serve a tour of duty in Vietnam, how long was that tour and--and how soon thereafter did you go?

Segment Synopsis: Graves departed for Vietnam in the summer of 1971. Graves says that she traveled from San Francisco to Japan and then on to Saigon. Graves recalls that she was the only female service member on the airplane, except for flight attendants. Upon arrival in Saigon, what stood out to Graves was a strong smell of burning diesel mixed with excrement, which she later found originated from burning human waste since there were no sanitation systems in the area at the time. Graves states that the military hospitals in Vietnam were not designed to help patients with extensive injuries, and that patients with the most severe cases were medically evacuated to Japan or back to the U.S.

Keywords: Injuries; Medical transfers; Saigon (South Vietnam); South Vietnam

Subjects: Airplanes; Airports; Bien Hoa Air Base (Vietnam); Buses; Camp Zama (Japan); Fear; Flight attendants; Hospitals; Independence; International travel; Japan; Medical care; Men; Military police; Nineteen seventies; Nurses; Nursing; Orthopedic nursing; San Francisco (Calif.); Smell; Soldiers; Uniforms; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vaccines; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Vietnam--Ho Chi Minh City; Women; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: . . . Tell me--tell me about your--do you remember your first day? Do you remember your impressions?

Segment Synopsis: When Graves arrived in Vietnam, a military police officer advised her to take a nursing position at a military hospital in Saigon. During her first week of work at the hospital in Saigon, Graves contracted dysentery. Graves primarily worked with patients who had STIs or bladder issues. Graves describes her tour of duty in Vietnam as both a positive and a negative experience. Graves enjoyed the sense of comradery cultivated between the doctors and nurses at her hospital. Graves also formed a close bond with her colleagues, since they worked twelve hour shifts six days a week and lived together in the nursing quarters. Graves also participated in the medical detail team that accompanied Sammy Davis Jr. and Bob Hope across Vietnam, which was part of a special Christmastime initiative to entertain the troops serving in Vietnam. Graves also had a difficult time processing all the violence and destruction around her. Graves recalls one mass casualty event that she dealt with involving a helicopter crash with around sixty service personnel on board with no survivors. Graves describes this experience as particularly grewsome and traumatic.

Keywords: Bob Hope; Comradery; Destruction; Doctors; Entertainment; Helicopter crashes; Jim Neighbors; Saigon (South Vietnam); Sammy Davis Jr.

Subjects: Beaches; Bladder; Celebrities; Change; Christmas; Cooperation; Coping; Death; Dysentery; Emotions; Friendship; Health; Helicopters; Hospitals; Kidneys; Mass casualties; Military police; Nature; Nervous system; Nineteen seventies; Nurses; Nursing; Orthopedic nursing; Post-traumatic stress disorder; Sexually transmitted diseases; Suffering; Thailand; Trauma; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vietnam; Vietnam War (1961-1975); Vietnam--Ho Chi Minh City; War; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: Before--before I went to Vietnam, you know, I'd--I would respond very appropriately to--to a situation that might bring you sadness . . .

Segment Synopsis: Graves had a difficult time processing the traumatic experiences she had in Vietnam. Graves says that before going to Vietnam, she was able to respond appropriately to emotions such as happiness or sadness, but once she came back from her tour of duty struggled with expressing her emotions. Graves recalls that many others around her in Vietnam resorted to drugs or alcohol to cope with the trauma that they were experiencing. Graves worked with many recovering drug addicts who were Vietnam returnees at the psychiatric unit at Fort Knox. Graves says she did not turn to drugs or alcohol as a coping mechanism for her trauma, but realized that many people she served with saw no better alternatives to process the traumatic experiences they underwent.

Keywords: Doctors; Overdoses; Psychiatric units

Subjects: Alcohol; Coping; Death; Drugs; Emotions; Fort Knox (Ky.); Heroin; Hospitals; Mass casualties; Mental health; Military; Post traumatic stress disorder; Shock; Trauma; United States; United States. Army; United States. Army Nursing Corps; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans---United States; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: . . . How were you able to--uh--decompartmentalize, and come back together more holistically?

Segment Synopsis: Graves found it difficult to talk about her experiences in Vietnam, since most people outside of other Vietnam War veterans could not relate to it. Graves says there was a stigma around being a veteran once she returned from Vietnam, because American public opinion had shifted away from supporting American involvement in the war. Graves explains that many Vietnam soldiers were young and decided to serve their country once they had been drafted. Graves corresponded and fell in love with a fellow Vietnam veteran from Louisville while she was on active duty. Graves says that she and her husband never truly shared with one another the traumatic experiences they underwent during their Vietnam service. Graves buried the trauma associated with her Vietnam service deep down and did not seek any counseling or support services when she came back to the U.S. After returning from Vietnam, Graves never worked in a hospital setting with veterans again, preferring to work in industrial nursing for the rest of her career. Graves says that she did not cry until twenty years after coming back from Vietnam, at the dedication of the Vietnam Women's Memorial in Washington D.C. in 1993.

Keywords: Feelings

Subjects: Americans; Coping; Correspondence; Crying; Demonstrations; Emotions; Home; Industrial nursing; Louisville (Ky.); Marriage; Military; Newspapers; Nurses; Nursing; Patriotism; Pediatric nursing; Post traumatic stress disorder; Psychology; Public opinion; Soldiers; Stigma (Social psychology); Trauma; Uniforms; United States; United States. Army; United States. Army Nursing Corps; Veterans; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans--United States; Vietnam Women's Memorial (Washington, D.C.); Volunteerism; War; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: Out of all the experiences and the time that has passed, what final conclusion do you have about Vietnam?

Segment Synopsis: In retrospect, Graves questions the purpose of American involvement in the Vietnam War. Graves believes that Vietnam as a country has made some progress in economic development, but the same social problems still persist that were of concern in the 1960s. Graves is concerned that soldiers today are taking on even more tours of duty than Vietnam veterans, and that they are not getting enough support to fully process their traumatic experiences. Graves states that she was never really in any grave danger while serving in Vietnam, but participated in several medical evacuations for patients. Graves says that she was probably not that aware of the reality of the situation on the ground in Vietnam to be overly concerned about her safety.

Keywords: Medical evacuations; North Vietnam; Saigon (North Vietnam); South Vietnam; Tours of duty

Subjects: Americans; Change; Communism; Coping; Death; Economic development; Helicopters; Hospitals; Mass casualties; Men; Military; Nurses; Nursing; Orphanages; Orthopedic nursing; Post traumatic stress disorder; Soldiers; Speeches; Trauma; United States. Army; United States. Army Nursing Corps; Veterans; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans--United States; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: Okay, and as a female service member, do you ever recall a time you experienced discrimination?

Segment Synopsis: Graves recalls that the spouses of non-military service member female military personnel were not considered dependents. While serving at Fort Knox, Graves attempted to claim her spouse as a dependent, but was unable to successfully add him to her benefits plan. Graves says that the ACLU of Kentucky wanted to support her and other female military personnel in a lawsuit against the military to get dependents benefits for their spouses, but Graves was put off by the idea when her head nurse warned that suing the government would be bad for her career. Graves learned how to be patriotic and truly appreciative of the sacrifices that veterans make for their country. Recently, Graves volunteered with several classmates from high school to help landscape the yard of a disabled Iraq War veteran. Graves found the experience to be eye-opening, since the veteran was in his mid-twenties and medically disabled with a wife and a baby daughter.

Keywords: ACLU; Active duty; Community service; Family; Husbands; Sacrifices

Subjects: American Civil Liberties Union; Americans; Dependents; Disabilities; Discrimination; Divorce; Fort Knox (Ky.); Health; Honor; Iraq War, 2003-2011; Landscaping; Marriage; Men; Military; Patriotism; Pensions; Post traumatic stress disorder; Prejudice; Sexism; Trauma; United States; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; Volunteers; Women; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: . . . What advice would you give women young women today who are thinking about serving and who do serve?

Segment Synopsis: Graves encourages women to join the military, since it is an opportunity to be adventurous. Graves adds that for nurses in particular, it is an opportunity to have different experiences than what is available in civilian nursing. Graves says that her Vietnam War experiences changed her as a person and made her appreciative of the standard of living in the U.S. Graves also advises that women veterans should share their experiences as soon as they return from active duty.

Keywords: Standard of living; Stigma

Subjects: Change; Character; Iraq War, 2003-2011; Mental health; Military nursing; Nurses; Nursing; Post traumatic stress disorder; Poverty; Trauma; United States; United States. Army; United States. Army Nurse Corps; Vietnam; Vietnam War, 1961-1975; War on Terrorism, 2001-2009; Women; Women veterans

Partial Transcript: I went through a severe depression in 1997 . . .

Segment Synopsis: Graves says that she struggled with a severe depression in 1997 from not processing the traumatic experiences she had in Vietnam over twenty years earlier. Graves explains that she did not acknowledge that she had changed as a person since returning from Vietnam. Graves believes that it is important for veterans to share their stories, so that they can have a better chance at moving on with their lives and having a good quality of life. After her struggles with depression, Graves started going to counseling at the VA in Louisville with a psychologist who also served in Vietnam. Graves encourages all veterans to take advantage of the free counseling services offered by the VA.

Keywords: Louisville VA Medical Center (Louisville, Ky.); Quality of life; Support

Subjects: Change; Coping; Counseling; Depression; Emotions; Healing; Louisville (Ky.); Mental health; Nurses; Nursing; Post traumatic stress disorder; Psychologists; Sharing; Trauma; Understanding; United States. Army; United States. Army Nursing Corps; United States. Department of Veterans Affairs; Veterans; Women veterans