Oral History Interview with Virgil Carrithers

“START OF TAPE 1, SIDE 1” Harris: Uh-huh.

Carrithers: …and I run down there and we finished our training there just before the armistice was signed, on November the 11th, they were expecting that to happen [Interruption]…in the reserve corps on November the 25th, and then I was discharged from the army, [Interruption] (sick?) as a corporal.

Harris: Well, they didn’t waste anytime, did they.

Carrithers: No. The commission was in the reserve [Interruption]…Kentucky active militia.

Harris: Yeah [Interruption]… to a, another issue (clears throat) excuse me, another issue of the book and it had, 1:00or it principally concerned one, one company of, Company B, I think from a, a different city.

Carrithers: It has.

Harris: And, I wondered if these, these…these pamphlets were [Interruption] each individual city or, c…whether they all came out of Frankfort.

Carrithers: Those were, includes the, the First Regiment something about each Company, and the, and the Second Regiment, I think there were two regiments, if I remember correctly.

Harris: Right, right. Yeah there were two regiments.

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: Three battalions in each regiment.

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: While we are on the subject…let’s talk a little bit 2:00about the active militia.

Carrithers: About which?

Harris: The active militia in the 1940s?

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: It was formed in nine…in 1940 [Interruption], did you… Carrithers: I, it was formed to take the place of the National Guard which had been called into federal service.

Harris: Yes. Did you join…at the very beginning of the active militia?

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: Uh-huh… Carrithers: I don’t remember the date I joined.

Harris: Well, Carrithers: Not, maybe not the first week, I just don’t remember.

Harris: Oh that’s okay. But when they fir… Carrithers: I think I joined around on May the Second.

Harris: Okay. Could you…talk with me a little about why you joined the active militia?

Carrithers: To serve my country.

Harris: To…patriotic reasons. 3:00Carrithers: Right [Interruption]…drew no pay, no drill pay.

Harris: Yeah, that was my next question. Since they drew no drill pay, it would be kind of hard to recruit an outfit like that in the, in this day and time, wouldn’t it?

Carrithers: I d…I don’t think so. Pe…people are generally patriotic and I think that it, if we happen to get into a war, and may God forbid it, I expect people would show their patriotism by joining.

Harris: Uh-huh. Well it’s a…the response to this crisis that’s going on in, in the Mid-East now seems to be pretty, pretty patriotic. 4:00Carrithers: Oh yes!

Harris: Yeah. Most people seem united of being there ( ).

Carrithers: That’s not like a, you know, a World war [Interruption].

Harris: It’s not anywhere near like that.

Carrithers: What did you say?

Harris: It’s not anywhere near like that.

Carrithers: Oh no.

Harris: Back to the active militia, for a second, you met at one night a week for drill and training… Carrithers: Right, for military training.

Harris: Right. Where did you meet, where did your company meet…at the armory?

Carrithers: Armory, down on Walnut Street.

Harris: On Walnut Street, okay. Was it a, a big building or, or what? Could you… Carrithers: Yes it, it’s a very big building.

Harris: How about… Carrithers: The drill floor.

Harris: Pardon?

Carrithers: The big drill floor. 5:00Harris: The big drill floor.

Carrithers: Yes, then you had fifty orderly rooms, on a mezzanine.

Harris: Oh, it sounds like a big building.

Carrithers: It is.

Harris: What kind of drills did you do?

Carrithers: Well you know, , you know, do you know what basic training is?

Harris: Oh Lord yes. You did… Carrithers: They [Interruption] they had target, target practice on the rifle range. we did guard duty at the Kentucky Derby, we had field maneuvers, simulated attack and defense operations.

Harris: Uh-huh. How well were these drills attended by the members?

Carrithers: Very well.

Harris: ( ) your company was about forty people, 6:00is that right?

Carrithers: I think that was about right, I’m, I just, at my age of 93, I don’t remember too well [Chuckling].

Harris: Yeah well, I’m sure, that’s, that’s hard to, hard to remember, but I read somewhere it was about forty and most of the people attended each week?

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: Oh, that’s very good.

Carrithers: Good attendance.

Harris: The equipment that you had, was that mostly World War I equipment?

Carrithers: We didn’t have any equipment.

Harris: Oh! What about uniforms?

Carrithers: We finally did get some rifles.

Harris: Yeah, I read that you got, that had—the militia had finally got some…1917 ri…infields… Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: Did…and 7:00that at one point…the army took those away and issued you all shotguns, is that correct?

Carrithers: Issued us shotguns?

Harris: Yeah, is that right?

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: What did the men think about that?

Carrithers: Ha! I don’t remember.

Harris: Oh, they didn’t like.

Carrithers: No, that I’m, I’m sure, well, I didn’t like it.

Harris: You, you didn’t? What were your reasons for not liking it?

Carrithers: Well I was just [Interruption] three Springfield was the best one.

Harris: Right.

Carrithers: I don’t remember whether we had any of those or not.

Harris: Hum, I think from what I read, I think they had Springfields early but they got infields…oh, about the middle of the war.

Carrithers: Maybe that was it, I just don’t remember.

Harris: Yeah, anyway…I 8:00also read that the militia had some trouble with uniforms with—trouble with getting uniforms. Did your company ever have trouble with that?

Carrithers: We finally got some uniforms, but in the early part of the game we did not have uniforms.

Harris: Uh-huh. Did that hurt morale?

Carrithers: No, I don’t think it hurt the morale at all, because we, we, the attendance was, was good.

Harris: Uh-huh. This is l…[Interruption] they had thirties and forties, or were they over?

Carrithers: No they were younger, I think.

Harris: Most of them were….

Carrithers: Younger men.

Harris: …teenagers?

Carrithers: ( ) maybe in their twenties, some men in the thirties.

Harris: Uh-huh. Well, they would 9:00be subject to the draft at that age.

Carrithers: Oh yes.

Harris: You had a pretty big tur… Carrithers: A lot of them, a lot of them enlisted, and if you will look in the…in this ‘Kentucky Militiamen’ volume two, number three, you will find some statements in there about the company losing people to the army.

Harris: Right.

Carrithers: I’m looking here for one. I haven’t found it yet [Interruption] Harris: …Well I r…[Interruption]…pretty, pretty rapidly.

Carrithers: Right.

Harris: Was it hard to keep morale up? [Interruption] 10:00Carrithers: If you look on page five of this volume that I’m looking at, you’ll find where we had a dance at the St. Matthews Armory.

Harris: Uh-huh. I read something about…frequent inspections and…competitions between the units to…to help build morale. Is that…do you remember that?

Carrithers: No, I don’t remember that. We probably had some competition. I was looking 11:00through here to see if I could find some mention of it. If you look through these books that’s up there, you might find some mention of competition.

Harris: Mm-mm. Okay, I’ll check that out. Did rationing during the war caused your company any particular problems?

Carrithers: Rationing?

Harris: Yeah.

Carrithers: No, no because we didn’t serve meals.

Harris: Well I read that some units had trouble getting…ammunition, and vehicles, and tires, and gasoline…they had trouble carrying out their maneuvers and drills. Did that ever happen in your company?

Carrithers: Yes, we finally did get [interruption] some sort of an armored vehicle, I, I’ve forgotten what it was now, 12:00but we had a company fund, out of which we bought gasoline for that vehicle.

Harris: Uh-huh. I remember that in 1945, the active militia all gathered at Camp Breckinridge for…a, a con…unit, for unit competitions. Do you remember that?

Carrithers: I remember that we were down there, but I don’t remember what happened.

Harris: Uh-huh. I read that one of the…w…one of the units was assigned to guard the German prisoners of war who were there. You don’t remember that either?

Carrithers: No, guarding German prisoners there?

Harris: For part of their time at Camp Breckinridge they did that, yeah.

Carrithers: No.

Harris: Okay 13:00[Interruption]…let’s see, you were a captain at this time, is that right? Were you a cap… Carrithers: Kentucky Active Militia, yes… Harris: Yeah, Captain, okay.

Carrithers: …in command of Company C of the First Regiment.

Harris: Do you remember who commanded Company A, and B?

Carrithers: Company A, let me see here. Yes, it’s Captain Richard A. Whitty, W-h-i-t-t-y.

Harris: Okay.

Carrithers: He was with (Belhaps?) Harris: Okay. Do you remember 14:00the Company B’s commander?

Carrithers: Yeah. Yes, I have it here, let me see, I’m trying to find it here [Interruption].

Harris: George Roberts.

Carrithers: Yeah, George Roberts was in command of Company C—of Company B.

Harris: I see, okay. Let me ask you about a couple of the other men. Do you remember the battalion commander Arthur Lacey (Baker?) 15:00Carrithers: Yes, I remember him, but he…I don’t know whether he went into the regular service or what, but we got a new…battalion commander, Lee Dentinger.

Harris: I’m sorry, Lee (Daneher?) Carrithers: D-e-n-t-i-n-g-e-r.

Harris: I see, okay, what kind of a man was Lacey (Baker?)?

Carrithers: I don’t remember him at all.

Harris: Oh!

Carrithers: He was not there, he wa…[interruption] when I, when I went in the militia.

Harris: Uh-huh. The…regimental comman…commander was Lieutenant Colonel Crump, do you remember him?

Carrithers: Who?

Harris: Crump.

Carrithers: Crump?

Harris: C-r-u-m-p.

Carrithers: No, not in our regiment. He was in Bowling Green. 16:00Harris: Oh! Okay, you never saw him?

Carrithers: Ah, yes, yes I saw him, but I don’t remember anything about him.

Harris: Uh-huh, I see. Okay, do you remember Robert Meyer? He was in C….

Carrithers: Robert who?

Harris: M-e-y-e-r, Meyer.

Carrithers: Oh yes! He just passed away. He was the first lieutenant in my company.

Harris: Right. What they promoted him to… Carrithers: Because he went to state staff.

Harris: He was a public relations officer for the AG, wasn’t he?

Carrithers: Yes, so state staff.

Harris: What kind of a man was he? 17:00Carrithers: Good man!

Harris: Okay…speaking of the AG, I read that…General…Polin was, is that right, Polin?

Carrithers: Pois, p-o-i-s [Interruption] Harris: General May. How those two men compare? Which wo… Carrithers: I wasn’t that close.

Harris: Oh, I did… Carrithers: …that I can tell you.

Harris: I just wondered…I read that May was sort of a hard to get along with.

Carrithers: I didn’t know.

Harris: Uh-huh. What about…after the war, the, when the National Guard came back, unit commands went to 18:00people with combat experience in World War II. How did the men in the active militia feel about that? Did that…make them mad? Up the… Carrithers: No.

Harris: No, they weren’t. They, they…accepted that?

Carrithers: Oh yes!

Harris: Uh-huh. Did…they didn’t re… [Interruption]…just part of the duty.

Carrithers: We had rendered our service…patriotically.

Harris: Ye…let me ask you about another individual. 19:00Do you remember…Sergeant Charles Cronan? He was in the headquarters of the First Regiment in Louisville.

Carrithers: Charles Cronan.

Harris: C-r-o-n-a-n.

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: He later became assis…assistant adjutant general.

Carrithers: Pardon?

Harris: He later became assistant adjutant general.

Carrithers: Yes.

Harris: I just wondered if you could tell me anything about him.

Carrithers: No, I wasn’t close enough to him.

Harris: Uh-huh. Well…it’s getting now around ten thirty. If you need to…to be going… Carrithers: It’s ten thirty-five.

Harris: Yeah. I think…I think we can wrap this up.

Carrithers: Okay! 20:00Harris: If…(Al?) you are aware that this, this conversation was being tape recorded, weren’t you.

Carrithers: Yeah, you told me that.

Harris: Yeah, okay. And…you are aware that I am a historian and I, I wr…I write things and publish them. Do you have any objection to my using this tape as a, a source for possible publications at some time.

Carrithers: ( ) Harris: Do you have any objection to my using this tape as a source for something that I might write and publish sometimes.

Carrithers: (yes, sure?) Harris: Okay. I’ll send you a form that’s a written permission for a release.

Carrithers: Okay.

Harris: And all you have to do is sign it and mail it back.

Carrithers: Right-o.

Harris: And I’ll try to get that off to you next week.

Carrithers: Okay. 21:00Harris: Well, I really appreciate this time you spent with me and this is very valuable information Sir.

Carrithers: Thank you very much ( ) when it’s publicized, I, I’d like to have a copy of it.

Harris: Okay, well, I’ll, I’ll, I got a lot of irons in the fire, so I can’t say when it will, when it will be.

Carrithers: Nothing urgent!

Harris: Oh, okay. Well, thank you a lot sir, I appreciate your… Carrithers: Thank you too for the conversation.

Harris: Okay, I appreciate your time.

Carrithers: Thank you sir.

Harris: Thank you.

Carrithers: Bye-bye.

“END OF INTERVIEW”