Oral History Interview with Don Neagle

ETHEL WHITE: This is a conversation with Don Neagle. We are at WRUS-AM in Russellville, Kentucky. It is February sixteenth, two thousand and one. My name is Ethel White. Would you start with a little of your own background, please.

DON NEAGLE: All right. I was born November third, nineteen thirty-seven in Green County, Kentucky, little rural community, actually called Exie, it’s near Greensburg. I went to a one-room school with the general overall topic which we are discussing, and of course in those days, totally segregated school. We knew African American people in the community, they went to their churches, we went to ours. I do remember, however, that, and I told you this on the phone once, my parents were what I consider today in two thousand and one, remarkably enlightened 1:00for their era. Not remarkably enlightened for two thousand one, but for nineteen forty-seven, nineteen forty-six, nineteen forty-eight, because I never....I was an only child. I never heard any derogatory remarks made about black people. I never was taught....I was completely dumbfounded later on to hear people talking about their presumed inferiority. I’d never heard that mentioned by my folks. And I remember as a youngster, a black man who lived next to us, near us, helped my grandfather, I guess it was, cut tobacco. And I remember he ate at the dinner table with us when my grandmother prepared the dinner for the workers. And I noticed that there was some, I didn’t know that there was anything unusual about it. I noticed later that there were some remarks or some 2:00eyebrow lifting about that. And I don’t know where my parents got their philosophy, other than they both loved to read a lot. They both had eighth grade educations, but they enjoyed reading and they read....I may have told you this. My parents, my father’s cousin owned the local newspaper, and he saved all the mass media publications for us to read, LIFE, LOOK, TIME, COLLIERS, AMERICAN MAGAZINE and all those. And we would read them, and maybe it came from there. They both loved to read since they were children, maybe that’s where they got that. Maybe they had read about things in the wider world and how people thought about things.

E.W.: How long did you stay in Green County?

NEAGLE: I stayed there until I was seventeen years old, and then was around, went to, was in Campbellsville and Harrodsburg and Glasgow and different places, and wound up in Russellville. I was going to school at Western and then I 3:00developed Diphtheria and married for the first time. And at that time was seeking a job and I came to Logan County. I was hired to go to work here, and so I never went back and got my degree. [Laughing] I’ve been here ever since.

E.W.: And what job did you get first?

NEAGLE: I was on the air. I was a disc jockey. I was playing country music and I was playing Elvis Presley, and playing Perry Como, and playing Doris Day and the Four Lads, and all that good stuff.

E.W.: And this was, when you say you came here in nineteen fifty-eight, was that what you came here to do? Be a disc jockey?

NEAGLE: And then later on started selling some advertising, writing advertising copy and then later on started doing news and things just evolved, and today, after forty-two years, my young partner and I are buying the radio station. I don’t think that’s, I don’t think, stay some place forty-two years and you wind up getting to own it, I don’t know if there is any moral or philosophy behind that. 4:00E.W.: When the nineteen fifty-four Brown vs. Board of Education decision came down, you would have still been in Green county...

NEAGLE: I was in high school.

E.W.: And in high school.

NEAGLE: I was in high school, in high school.

E.W.: Did you hear anything about it at the time?

NEAGLE: We heard it talked about. At that time it didn’t affect us. I graduated in fifty-five, there had been no changes in the circumstances of the school at that time. And then later on, I remember I was at Western. I was out of school working for a while, I mean out of high school, then went back to college. And I remember, I went to Western in fifty...I was there in late fifty-six, the fall of fifty-six and spring of fifty-seven. I’m sorry, the fall of fifty-seven and spring of fifty-eight. I had one black young lady in one of my classes that time, that was all at that time. She was in Chemistry class, by the way she did much better in that Chemistry class than I did.

E.W.: Do you, and of course we’ll focus 5:00on your time here, but does that mean that your memories, I mean there sort of wasn’t much in the way of talk or action? In the areas where you were before you came here to Logan county.

NEAGLE: I never, it, it sort of was accepted this was something that was going to happen. And I don’t recall any protest about it. I don’t recall anybody being upset. I don’t recall any Klan groups coming in or anything. It was pretty well, as I recall, accepted as this is the way it is going to be.

E.W.: All right, then you came here in nineteen fifty-eight, and it took you, what, a couple of few years to get into the news part of radio? Early sixties maybe?

NEAGLE: Right, I didn’t actually start, I actually started doing news as such, it was the late sixties, but I was an observer of what was going on. Early in the sixties, 6:00I remember a group of us would meet at the Catholic Church, I guess it was the Catholic parish house, and black and white group, and talk about race relations. I don’t know that we did anything particularly about it, but we would meet and talk.

E.W.: Now, was this under the auspices of the church?

NEAGLE: I don’t know.

E.W.: Or did you just use the building?

NEAGLE: I think it was just use of the building. The priest was very much a supporter, Father Gene Ryan. And there was another, there was a Presbyterian minister here too, Tom McGloshin(*), who also was interested in this. We would meet and talk. I don’t know that....Some of my earlier memories of when I first came here, I remember there was a church, a black church group that met here in Russellville. This would have been like fifty-nine or so, and I remember they were perturbed because 7:00there was really no place for them to stay. They had to stay in private homes, not that we’ve ever been blessed with a great variety of hostelries anyway.

E.W.: And this was a visiting, excuse me for interrupting, this was a visiting group from outside that came here?

NEAGLE: This was some kind of convention, like a church convention.

E.W.: And needed a place to stay. Okay.

NEAGLE: And I remember, if I’m not wrong, I think that Alice Allison Dunnigan, who is from here. I think I remember her expressing displeasure that these people came in and weren’t able, you know weren’t able to find mainstream lodging and the like. You’re familiar with who she is, right?

E.W.: Uh hmm.

NEAGLE: I think I remember that. There also used to be the idea that if black groups came in here, I remember really 8:00early on, wanting to protest or demonstrate, that the black power structure here would discourage it and tell them to not do so. There was not much sympathy with one or two who, I guess by their actions they received favor from the political, from the white political powers that be. And a part of their job was to sort of keep down any discord. I remember one instance in which I understood that some people, some young people came in and probably wanted to do some kind of protesting of some kind, and they were told by one particular man, who held great power and delivered the vote of the black people, that to get on out of here, we don’t want you here, disturbing, I guess, 9:00his arrangement with the powers.

E.W.: Why do you suppose....What was the black power structure thinking? If they went along with the white power structure, is what you’re saying?

NEAGLE: Yeah.

E.W.: What were they getting out of it?

NEAGLE: I’m thinking of one particular man. I understood if he delivered the black vote, they would overlook the fact that he ran a bootleg operation or something like that. This is all vague memory, my understanding of the situation of the time.

E.W.: And what if anything at this time, this was before you were part of the news media, do you remember seeing anything about any, you know, race relations or desegregation in the press 10:00or on the radio or television? Was there any local commentary that you remember?

NEAGLE: Early on I don’t remember. The person who did news for us at one time, I remember after calls from some of the black people protesting, he stopped designating, when there would be an arrest, he would stop saying, Joe Blow, Russellville, Negro was arrested. He stopped doing that, I remember. That was one thing from....As far as there being any real coverage, any real support of integration efforts, I don’t recall there being that.

E.W.: So you don’t recall commentary say on the black church group that had no place to stay or anybody covering this black and white race relations group that you joined?

NEAGLE: Not as such, 11:00no. I don’t recall any news coverage of it.

E.W.: Now what happened with this race relations, this interracial race relations group? You said they talked a lot. Did anything ever come of it?

NEAGLE: We met a lot. I don’t recall anything other than, we sort of got together and feel pretty, feel like a bunch of good liberals and that we were on the right side of history, and feel pretty good about it. And then we didn’t really do anything as I recall, frankly. [Laughing] E.W.: Who else....So you would have been maybe in your twenties.

NEAGLE: Yeah, right.

E.W.: What other white people were there? Do you remember?

NEAGLE: I’m trying to remember. As I say, I think the Reverend McGloshin(*) was there and Father Ryan. As far as there being, there were others there, but here I’m drawing a blank as to who they were.

E.W.: Well I’m asking you to think back forty years, so that’s okay. Do you remember any local activity during the sit-ins in the other part of the country? 12:00This would be early sixties, and once again, you were not part of the media. Do you remember any of that coming here?

NEAGLE: Any local activity as far as...?

E.W.: Yeah, you know public accommodations stuff. That would have been early sixties in other places.

NEAGLE: I don’t recall anything going on. I do remember when the state public accommodations law was passed under the Breathitt administration, that, I remember one particular merchant downtown said he felt he should have the right to say who comes into his business, he shouldn’t have to admit just anybody, he should have that right. I remember that.

E.W.: That was nineteen sixty-six, I think.

NEAGLE: I think, I know it was the mid-sixties. I don’t recall any, I don’t recall any instances of sit-ins or demonstrations or whatever in this town.

E.W.: Do you have a sense that the, [Laughs] the black vote was still being bought?

NEAGLE: Well I think for a long time it was. I think there was an arrangement, an agreement. 13:00And whether that went on and whether there was discouragement from...I don’t know. I’m trying to get back into my grey matter and see what I do remember. Because I told someone one time, I am a terrible one to notice a trend. You can, something has to knock me down before I notice it. I look back and say oh yeah, this happened, but the time, I’m just, every day is every day.

E.W.: Well maybe I should, maybe I should, we should leap a little, and I should ask you what you remember once you first started in the news business on radio. Do you remember a first incident that perhaps you either reported on or decided not to report on?

NEAGLE: No, I remember I used to cover early on, they’d have NAACP meetings. They’d have a speaker here and I would go and cover the meeting. I remember there was a 14:00minister from Louisville one time, I’ve forgotten his name, that spoke at a local NAACP meeting. I was the only white person there and I sat at, they invited me to sit at the head table. And it was a dinner and a meeting. And he spoke very fervently about persecutions by white people for the past four hundred years, and he would stop occasionally and look at me and say, I’m not talking about you brother. It sort of threw his rhythm off a little bit, but that’s one I remembered. I always, you know, I’ve not always done the right thing, but I think as far as race relations, I’ve tried to do the right thing. I’m not setting myself as some great example or anything, but I think....And of course our friend, Al Smith, was like that too. He and I talked about this a lot, and we shared thoughts about this. But 15:00I’m not saying that I was this great pure - but I tried to do the right thing.

E.W.: All right, well now when you say you and Al Smith talked about all this, do you mean at the time, when he was at the Russellville paper and you were here?

NEAGLE: I think we did, I think we did. As far as what Al may have run in the paper, I don’t know. He may have done commentaries, he may have done things, he may have written columns, he may have had editorials. I just don’t recall now what, of course it would be a matter of researching the local papers to see. I know where his sympathies were, and he very well could have done some things. We have never done editorials here at the station. The only thing that I could have done was try to be fair about what I reported in the presentations other than. Ever since I can remember we’ve tried, since I’ve been doing the news, we’ve tried to be fair and give equal coverage to what the African-American folks were doing, as well as, what the others were doing. Tried to be fair. 16:00E.W.: Have you made your own decisions? Or was there somebody else deciding where you would go?

NEAGLE: Actually, actually from the very beginning, only a time or two were my judgments ever questioned And I pretty well, as I recall, was able to determine where I went, what I did. It was pretty well left up to me. And there were only very rarely, and then usually I would argue my position with our general manager, and most times he would say, okay if that’s the way you feel about it, go ahead.

E.W.: Well, do you remember anything about when the schools were desegregated here?

NEAGLE: They were starting to be when I came here, and as I recall, I think what they did, they maybe would desegregate....In fact I have a tape here, that if you want to take with you, I’ll be glad to let you have. It’s an interview with the Reverend George Allison, who is now deceased, who was a nephew of Alice Allison Dunagan, 17:00who was in the first Russellville High School integrated senior class. And we talked about that, did the interview, I’m not sure I have the exact date. It was two or three years ago, three or four years ago. And if you want to take that with you, if that’s any help to you, I’ll be glad to let you take that.

E.W.: That would be great.

NEAGLE: But they were starting this, I think it started here in Russellville with the senior class. And then I don’t know whether they, I forgot whether they worked back down that way or how they did. But I know that when I came, Knob City School was still in operation. In fact I guess, it may have been that year or the next year after I came that they first integrated the Russellville school.

E.W.: Knob City is the, was the black school.

NEAGLE: Knob City was the black school. It is now used for a Head Start center, community service. It all was happening slowly. My daughter is forty. She will be forty-one in May, and she went all through the Russellville city schools. And I’m sure it was integrated all the way through there. 18:00She would have started in first grade. And she was born in sixty, so what? Sixty-six, she was Kindergarten in sixty-five. As a matter of fact, her Kindergarten class was integrated, as I recall. So at least by then everything was integrated. I’ve forgotten the structure. I think they started a little along, maybe a class at a time.

E.W.: Well, just for the sake of co-ordination, do you remember any highlights from that interview with the Reverend George Allison? Or do you remember any of his particular feelings about...?

NEAGLE: He talked about that when the decision came down, and I’ve forgotten...

E.W.: The Brown Decision?

NEAGLE: Yeah, Brown vs the Board of Education.

E.W.: That’s fifty-four.

NEAGLE: And that, but they didn’t, this was later on. And I’m thinking probably this may have been fifty-six, I’m not sure, of that graduating class. Because he was in the same class as my friend Jerry White, who owns a pharmacy here, and we’ve talked about that. 19:00He talked about something that is very interesting, because the coach then, or maybe it was the principal, I’ve forgotten which. They came to see and talk to some of these guys, because they were very interested in getting them on the football team. [Laughing] I remember that. So that may have eased the transition there somewhat. I remember...

E.W.: So there was a choice? The black kids didn’t have to go to the white school?

NEAGLE: Well if there was a choice, there wasn’t a choice very long, obviously. Well, maybe they all, maybe all, maybe all who were going to be in the senior class did go, but he was coming and talking to them about the ones who wanted to play football. I guess that’s what it was. I remember there was a young man named George Hill here, who was an outstanding student, outstanding athlete. 20:00And he moved away and became a doctor; I’ve lost track. I never really knew him, but people did. And they asked him one time if he would, why he didn’t come back here and set up his practice. He said, well the social life, there was none. I remember a young...

E.W.: Now, now, let me just back you up. George Hill was a black student athlete?

NEAGLE: Yes, black student, right.

E.W.: And when he says no social life, did he mean no integrated social life?

NEAGLE: Well he was saying, no, I think that he meant, well...

E.W.: Go ahead.

NEAGLE: First of all, where he had to live, the segregated life, this was many years ago, the segregated places you had to live. And nobody else of his particular intellectual or financial, same type of people who would be here. Because this is one thing, and I’ve said this before, we have suffered terribly here by not having a black middle, sizable black middle class. We just don’t have enough of it. 21:00So many of the promising young folks go off somewhere, and we just don’t have it. We’ve never had a sizable black middle class. I remember a young, there used to be....the county agents, the county agricultural agents, you’d have one for the white farmers, you’d have one for the black farmers. What they used to call the home demonstration agents. Now there’s another name, but there would be those for the white ladies and another for the black ladies. And I remember one, a young guy named James Hardin. And I remember knowing him and his wife, I think he lived in Bowling Green, I believe. And I remember when my daughter was a little bitty girl, that my first wife and my daughter and I went to Bowling Green to visit him and his wife and his daughter, or his little boy maybe. 22:00And I remember looking out the window and seeing my daughter, who was a little white girl, walking and playing with his little black boy. And I thought well some folks probably had a hissy fit over that. And then he later moved away. I don’t know whatever happened to him. But I remember visiting them. I don’t know if they ever came to visit us. I don’t remember that, I don’t remember that, whether they did or not. These are all just, sort of images out of nowhere.

E.W.: No, that’s fine. Images out of nowhere is great. Do you remember any issues over housing?

NEAGLE: No, I remember, I’m sure there have been. And I’m sure that bright, young black people have felt that they were not able to buy homes. I live to this day in a segregated subdivision. 23:00I have no problem with, but it’s that way. To my knowledge there’s no black family that lives in the subdivision where I live. It’s one of the subdivisions that came into existence in the sixties and there are no blacks live there now. So often, they have felt they had to go out in the country. I mean for instance, you have a couple here, Clarence and Marie Gamble, and he’s been a school administrator for years, and she’s a counselor for mental health. They have a farm, they live out in the country. It was simpler for them, if they wanted to have a nice home, they buy a piece of property out in the country and build it. There’s the same situation, I think, with another young couple, the lady who was in management in a local industry, and her husband, I’ve forgotten what he does. But they’re fine people. But they live in the country. It’s always been a simpler thing, less hassles, I guess. Now, I know that there’s one, I think there’s one black family that lives in one of the other “white” 24:00subdivisions here. I don’t recall hearing any, anybody complaining about that. But it’s, Sunday is still segregated. Now my church, the pastor of my church and the pastor of Mt. Zion Baptist swap pulpits from time to time.

E.W.: What is your church?

NEAGLE: It’s a Baptist church, it’s a country Baptist church. Swap pulpits, but it’s still.

E.W.: Is this black and white congregations?

NEAGLE: Yeah, there are some, there may be a handful, maybe a congregation or two, I think what they call Hillview Heights Church, I think has some black and white members. But your old line churches, traditional churches, there may be some that go to the Presbyterian Church here. I don’t know. But almost, you know, ninety-nine percent is totally segregated. And of course, people say well black people have their style of worship, white people have their style of worship and nobody’s happy, nobody’s comfortable, you know. 25:00E.W.: Did you ever during the, say sixties and seventies, did you cover any political, city council meetings or anything like that?

NEAGLE: Oh yeah.

E.W.: What is your memory about how the political leaders were, other than buying the black votes. [Laughing] NEAGLE: The Russellville City Council, the first city councilman was a man named Harvey Smith, who was a building contractor.

E.W.: When you say first councilman...?

NEAGLE: First black councilman.

E.W.: Black councilman, okay.

NEAGLE: And he was pretty much old school, considered to be one that wouldn’t rock the boat, as I recall. Kind of you know, I guess they use the word token, but I think that may have been..

E.W.: When, roughly, I mean we’re talking seventies or sixties?

NEAGLE: No, the sixties.

E.W.: Okay, that’s fine.

NEAGLE: I think it was in the late sixties. I remember when the city hired the first 26:00black policeman, Jerry English, and that was considered a big, quite a step up.

E.W.: Same era?

NEAGLE: Yeah. I think there has been one member, there has been one black member of Logan Fiscal Court, I think, unless I am mistaken. And that was Charles Neblett, who was a civil rights....are you familiar with, you know who Charles Neblett is? He was one of those who did the freedom rides and the longest ( ) and was a member of the Freedom Singers. And they went to the Smithsonian some time back. You know who he is. He was, it was a situation in which, I think there were like three candidates and the two whites divide up the white votes and he got elected. He never got re-elected. But he blended in rather well. There was one particular old line white fiscal court member they said would have problems, you know, he wouldn’t accept this. And he and Charles got along better 27:00than any of the two. They seemed to respect each other. There was Doctor R. L. Yoakley(*), I think was the first black member of the Russellville School Board. And of course, he was an economics professor at Western for a number of years, and co-author of a book on the black church. I remember back in the sixties I did an interview. I wish I had it, you know some things I wish, I don’t know what I did with. But I did an interview with him on the nature of the black church. He and another guy had co-written a book on that. He was, he’s still alive, his wife died recently or a year or two ago. He’s in his eighties now. If there’s ever, I don’t know if there’s ever been a black member of the Logan County School Board. I don’t recall it if there has. There could have been, I don’t recall.

E.W.: Did you cover any of these meetings. Do you remember?

NEAGLE: Oh yeah, I covered a lot of them, over the years, the seventies through the eighties, I was going to all of them. 28:00E.W.: Does anything loom large in your memory? Were there any divisions or intense debates or big troubles that were aired in any way? Or was it all pretty quiet?

NEAGLE: I don’t recall anything major, but there may have been something. But I don’t remember anything particularly significant. A humorous thing I might tell you, I remember back in, about sixty-six, we were getting our library district organized to build a new library and by petition. I was given a number of places to go to speak. And a lady and I went to the A.M.E. Zion Church , and we were told that there was going to be a demonstration there that night. And I thought well this will be interesting to see, but it turned out to be a waterless cookware demonstration. [Laughing] So we had a combination religious service, waterless cookware 29:00demonstration and petition signing, got ninety some odd signatures on the petition that night. And we did get, the library district established and the new library.

E.W.: Do you remember any, this all sounds really quite peaceful or at least quiet.

NEAGLE: Yeah, I don’t recall, yeah quiet at least, peaceful at least under the, kept quiet. I don’t recall, I don’t recall, unless I’m just having total mental blanks, which I probably am. But I don’t recall any major blow-ups of any kind. Did Turner remember anything? If so maybe you can jog my memory. Did he remember anything like that? [Laughter] E.W.: Well, you know I probably shouldn’t color your thinking, but my impression of the area is quiet. And what I haven’t figured out yet is what was going on, if anything, beneath the quiet. 30:00Maybe nothing. You are giving me the impression, and I shouldn’t draw conclusions, you are giving me the impression that there was some unhappiness, but that it didn’t really surface.

NEAGLE: I’m sure there was, but I don’t recall it surfacing.

E.W.: Do you remember any other interviews, either of black people in the area or of anybody on the subject of race relations or civil rights?

NEAGLE: Of course, you know, I have over the last several years have done a number, but now whether they were...

E.W.: You mean recent years?

NEAGLE: Yeah, recent years, you know. But I don’t recall. I’ve done a number with Nebeitt about his experiences in the South, Doctor Marion Lucas from Western on his book on the history of Blacks in Kentucky, 31:00you know different ones. Doctor John E. Long at Western and his...

END OF TAPE 20.O.15, DON NEAGLE, SIDE A BEGINNING OF TAPE 20.O.15, DON NEAGLE, SIDE B NEAGLE: ....as the leader.

E.W.: Okay, series of programs?

NEAGLE: I did a series of programs in the sixties on religion, different churches. I was going through my Agnostic period about that time, and did a whole lot of interviews with different ministers. And I remember black ministers I did interviews, but it was on religion, it was not on civil rights as such. I did the Baptist minister here, and Reverend Dunlop, the Methodist minister, and different ones about the beliefs of their church. I don’t remember anything specifically about their feelings about the civil rights issue.

E.W.: So religious beliefs were not, at least for purposes of the interviews tying together with...

NEAGLE: Yeah, how come do you baptize babies and you folks don’t? [Laughing] You know, that type of thing. Real profound theology there, as you can imagine.

E.W.: Does anything, and I know I’m asking 32:00you to remember a long way back. Does anything stick out in your mind, say on the interview with Doctor Lucas about the history of Blacks in Kentucky, I mean anything sort of loom large, or was it?

NEAGLE: No, we just talked about....that was in the last four or five years we did that.

E.W.: Did you ever do any call-in shows on the subject?

NEAGLE: Not until, we didn’t start a call-in show until eighty-four, so this has been fairly recent that we do this. Do it every day, five days a week now. And of course, we’ve done many on it since then, but you know it’s not the same. You do it now, and so what. But doing one in nineteen sixty-two would have been a different thing all together.

E.W.: But has anything surfaced in your recent programs about feelings back then? Or is it mostly about what is going on now?

NEAGLE: I’m trying to think if we have talked about, 33:00it seems that mainly I’ve talked to people about what is going now. Of course, I talked to Neblett about what he did in the South. He wasn’t here then. I don’t recall anything. I know, even though I was naive and thought everybody, everything was happy, I know in retrospect there had to be these resentments and these feelings and all, but at that time I was sort of oblivious to it, I guess.

E.W.: Well and you’re, I think you’re painting the picture of a town or a county that did appear to be...

NEAGLE: I remember Mr. Alec Kimbrough(*) a black man, I remember when he was named, he was the first black man to ever be on a Logan County Grand Jury. I remember that. And he was, as a matter of fact, the local paper did do a story on that, I remember that. He was the first black ever on the grand jury. 34:00E.W.: And when these kinds of appointments, elections happened, you don’t remember any protests?

NEAGLE: I don’t remember, there may have been...

E.W.: Or any cheers, or...

NEAGLE: There may have been those quietly said, why it’s getting totally out of hand. But I don’t recall anybody, any public protest. It was sort of a general patting one’s [patting sound] look how broad minded we are, that type of thing, you know, look what a good thing, look how great we are doing this.

E.W.: Do you remember any fallout here from either, I mean nineteen sixty-eight was of course, the year when the cities were burning, and the assassinations happened.

NEAGLE: I remember being at Houchen’s market one night, and this older white lady I knew said, she said, that Martin Luther King’s been killed, it’s a good thing. I remember hearing that.

E.W.: But you don’t, I mean the black community here 35:00didn’t pick up on any of that?

NEAGLE: No.

E.W.: Or any of the school desegregation, the busing, of course you didn’t have busing here. So the busing controversy in Louisville would not have carried over here.

NEAGLE: No, the only thing that happened with busing, people were happy to see, people in the South were happy to see on T.V., the folks in South Boston screaming and looking as mean as the folks in Mississippi had, you know. This thing isn’t just restricted to the South. They were very satisfied to see that. No, I don’t recall any, something flipped through my brain a moment ago, but it is gone now. Oh, I remember being, a lady, Miss Jennie Benton owned a nursing home here for older black people. And I remember being in her home once, doing some advertising, I guess, for her. And I remember being in her home to get the advertising and I saw a picture of Martin Luther King on the wall. And at that time, somewhere in the early 36:00to mid sixties, I was kind of surprised. I didn’t know black people here, really thought...I didn’t know they even....I didn’t know that they really were that, liked Martin Luther King that much. And I found out later on, they all did. They were all inspired by him. They all...they didn’t, you know, maybe it wasn’t good to talk about.

E.W.: Well and...

NEAGLE: They’re such a minority. See we’ve got what, ten percent blacks in Russellville. If they’d wanted to do something, what could they have done? I mean they’re such a minority. It’s not like in Mississippi, you know, where some of these counties are seventy-five percent black. And I don’t know what the, I’ve forgotten what the black population of the county is, but there aren’t that many black folks that live in, out in the county anymore, because farmers now with mechanized farming don’t need all the black farm hands they used to have. And those who, so many of them came to town and there are only ten to fifteen percent, something like that here. So they never had a real number, power base in numbers, really. 37:00So it’s always having to go along to get along.

E.W.: And yet from what you say, there was no great protest on the part of the whites when the blacks were entering the white schools.

NEAGLE: I don’t recall it, now I heard a story told that there was one guy who ran a grocery store here, that he said he was going to go, and he was going to cause some trouble down there. But I understand also that some of the others, other white leaders put the pressure on him to shut up and stay out and stay away. You are not going to cause trouble. I think they had, maybe they were aware of what had been seen to be going on in other places. And I don’t know whether they were aware that it was a bad thing, as far as, you know we were going through a big industry recruiting time through there. Whether some of the leaders thought this is bad publicity. I don’t know that, I really hadn’t thought much about it. That may have figured in their minds 38:00too. Because the late fifties is when Rockwell came here, Emerson Electric came here, other plants started coming. And we got exposed to, we got exposed to Northern people, you know, use the term. You know what I mean. [Laughing] We got used to people who had, even before I came here, to people who had came from the North, had different accents, they were Catholics or Lutherans or whatever, and not all Southern Baptists from out in the country. And we sort of got exposed to people who had different ways of looking at things. They soon blended in and became the presidents of the Kiwanis Club and the Rotary Club and the Chamber of Commerce and so on. So it may have had a little different perspective. Industry will do that for you.

E.W.: Well, then you answered the question that I didn’t even have to ask, which was to try to get some sense 39:00of the reasons for all this. Because there are places in other parts of Kentucky like Clay County, Sturgis, where there was a certain amount of trouble.

NEAGLE: Sure, I remember that, yeah. I don’t know. I’ve always....in this old county there has always been a little element of gentility, I think. It had two colleges years ago, they both had to close. I know one lasted until the Depression. It was a male college, for males, it was Bethel College. And there was a Logan female college. And some of the older families like to flatter themselves, well, these are fine old Virginia families that came here, or fine old North Carolina families, and they don’t do cruddy, trashy things. They’re not rednecks and if they’re poor they deal with it on a pretty high level. Whether that be the case or not, I’m not one of those old families. My folks scrambled down from New Haven, Connecticut and New Jersey back in the seventeen hundreds and wound up in Kentucky. 40:00So I’m not one of the old southern families. And my folks fought for the Union. [Laughter] E.W.: Well I know we agreed that you have to be on the air in about five minutes, so I guess it’s time to wind it up.

NEAGLE: Well I enjoyed this. I will give you this tape and you take it with you, and if you will when you get finished with it, if you will mail it back to me, I’d appreciate it.

E.W.: I will. Thank you so much.

NEAGLE: Sure.

END OF INTERVIEW