Oral History Interview with Afton Smith

AFTON SMITH: I’ll wait for your other remarks and then you can ask me if you like.

CASSIE MULLINS: Okay, that’s fine.

SMITH: I’m staying here where I was born at the Hindman Settlement School, just below where the settlement hospital was after, was later located. The women founders of said school purchased the property from my dad, G. C. Smith, who had acquired same from my grandfather, W. W. Baker. Bill Baker, who moved to Oklahoma, but later returned to Kentucky and settled in Hazard. 1:00Then when I became of school age, I attended grade school in the old, big, three-story building of many classrooms, which was located approximately where the library is presently located. Now, some of those, like that library, may not be there now.

C.M.: Yeah, there’s a library.

SMITH: The old grade school building is reflected in a piece of art by my sister, May Smith. In front of this building was a wood fence, and just outside it was a wood boardwalk, next to Highway number one sixty. After a good many years, a part of the playground consisted of the basketball court, and just below 2:00it was a tennis court. Directly behind this building was a smaller structure where we took our high school classes. I recall being in a class taught by attorney Clark Pratt. His mother lives there now, I believe.

C.M.: Yeah.

SMITH: He is deceased. Near this building was another structure and so forth. In Manual Training, I made some things like dulcimers and tables and so on. I stayed here. I was stupid in selling my dulcimer for four dollars to a John Hopkins from Prestonsburg, who was in Hindman campaigning for circuit judge. And then after graduating from Hindman High School, I attended my first college here at what is presently known as Eastern State University at Richmond. After attending there, others attending there 3:00the same year were, Beckham Combs, former Superintendent of the schools, Beckham Combs, Pearl Combs, his brother, Kirby Amburgey, Arthur Pigman, ( ) Pigman and T( ) Bailey. I remember I mention something about T( ) Bailey. After my first year at Eastern, I enrolled at U.K., where I completed my legal training. After obtaining my law license, I returned to Hindman. H.H. Smith, Sr. gave me access to his library, which I used in practice. And in addition to general practice, I was employed as city attorney. Later Pearl Harbor was attacked. And I write some stupid things about that, I guess. Along with more than, with other fellows, three busloads, departed Hindman 4:00and on that day we were inducted into the service at Huntington, West Virginia and so forth and so forth. I’ll skip down there to.... Pursuant to completion of this training I was sent to ( ) Field, Florida. And I mention there about the Brooklyn Navy Yards, had to wait there for a boat. And about some of my trips on a boat. And then going overseas. I bumped into Sid Gayhart of Kilmer, at Kilmer, I was in a Signal Corps outfit at that, our outfit, the Ninth Air Command, in the Air Force. We were on the same shipping orders. We left Kilmer by train, arrived at Newport News in January, so forth and so on. 5:00We traveled south....this is on our way....Next morning, December the twentieth, nineteen forty-two, we sailed. Our ship was unconveyed and after we were an hour or so from port, our ship began the old zig zag routine the rest of the trip. We were forty-three days getting to our destination, Port Said, Egypt. This zig zag obviously was to avoid submarine radar. We traveled south and so on. ( ) south crossing the equator. 6:00I can’t very well read this myself, I don’t see how anybody else could. [Laughter] Tip of Africa, north to Port Said, Egypt. After staying at ( ), Camp ( ) a few miles from Cairo, belonging to the British, we moved to Tripoli and remained there until the enemy had been driven from Africa, and for the most part driven from Italy. Thereafter we embarked for England and went by boat there. I’ll skip on down here. From Liverpool we traveled by train 7:00to South England to British base located between Andover and Salisbury, where we were housed in barracks until the invasion of France, where the Germans had been occupying for a long period of time. The fighter plane pilots did their parts in the invasion while there....Personally my activities consisted of working for the court martial. Others and I were dispatched from R( ), Belgium back to the states on a rotation basis. I went over there, well, I went over on a Christmas 8:00and came back on a Christmas two years later.

C.M.: So, you were gone for two whole years.

SMITH: I was overseas two years, yes. ...By spending Christmas on the ocean going over and coming back. From Boston I passed through Camp Atterbury, Indiana, on my way to the redistribution center at Miami Beach, Florida. After a couple of months there, I was assigned to the Judge Advocate Section of Bowman Field, near Louisville. And I remained there, until separated. Well...

C.M.: They ( ) together.

SMITH: After returning home, I returned, I resumed 9:00my law practice. A few years later, Carl S. Perkins, you’ve heard of them, I guess.

C.M.: Right.

SMITH: Then county attorney, ran for and was elected to Congress. I ran and was elected for his unexpired term as County Attorney. In nineteen fifty-one, I ran for Commonwealth Attorney and was in the present district composed of Knott and Magoffin counties. I ran for the same office for the next five successive terms, six-year terms and fortunately had no opposition in either of these last five races. I am now serving in said office on the thirty-sixth year. 10:00I now feel that I was stupid in getting into and remaining in public office, rather than sticking to private practice where the money was. [Laughter] Where the money is.

C.M.: Yeah.

SMITH: I married Janice Hayes after my return from the military and lived in Hindman, where we had two sons, Granby Jennings and Douglas. They both live in Lexington and are policeman. That’s back then. And I say a little something about their children. Each one had two children. Each one had a son and daughter. My current term of office will end this year, and I did not seek the office again. Thirty-six years in the office was a bellyful. 11:00And here I just wrote a little note here, July nineteen ninety-eight, I now feel lonely as I am left alone, except for my now immediate family, having no longer a brother or sister, Greda having departed this life, June the fourteenth, nineteen ninety-eight. That substantially is what I sort of ( ). Remember about going to the school, you know....From being a baby and then remaining so, if this would be worth anything, why you’re free to take it. Of course, I have a copy too.

C.M.: Okay. That’s good though, I mean, that you wrote all that down, I think. If you don’t care I have a few questions 12:00for you. That’s okay. Before I turned the recorder on, you were telling me about your family, so could you tell about that again? Like how many brothers and sisters you had, and things.

SMITH: Well, I had five brothers and six sisters, and they’re all gone.

C.M.: So, you are the only one that is remaining now?

SMITH: Yes.

C.M.: Okay.

SMITH: And I am ninety years of age now, was on the fifteenth of April past.

C.M.: And I didn’t state this at the beginning, but just so we’ll have it on the tape, today’s date is July the sixteenth, nineteen ninety-eight.

SMITH: Yeah.

C.M.: And talking to Afton Smith, who graduated in nineteen twenty-eight from the Hindman Settlement School. And now your family, you were telling me before I turned this on, that’s where the land came from. It that correct?

SMITH: Yeah, we moved down there in the house, I learned later. 13:00After they sold the property to the ladies at the school, we moved to a house that was down near the forks of Troublesome. You know how it forks there?

C.M.: Yeah.

SMITH: And on this land in front of the school, we moved there and then later moved to another place on the other fork, just a little ways up. The other fork of Troublesome Creek, I might say.

C.M.: Yeah, so when you were going to school at the settlement, did you live at the campus or did you live at home?

SMITH: I lived at home.

C.M.: Lived at home, okay.

SMITH: We all did, all my brothers and sisters that attended school went to the Hindman Settlement School.

C.M.: Okay, so your whole family went there.

SMITH: All of them went. All of us went. 14:00C.M.: Now, did you go there in grade school?

SMITH: Yes.

C.M.: All the way through? Pretty much.

SMITH: Yes.

C.M.: Maybe there are some things you remember about being in school at the settlement. Are there any people that stand out in your mind, maybe like teachers you had? I guess when you were there, May Stone would have been there?

SMITH: Uh hmm.

C.M.: What do you remember about Miss Stone?

SMITH: Well, I just remember that she was one of the main people that was connected with the school. Miss Watts, Elizabeth Watts, I believe it was, right? Miss Pettit, was she one too?

C.M.: Yeah.

SMITH: I might not be able to remember any of the others.

C.M.: Okay, well that’s all right. Do you remember anything about Miss Watts 15:00maybe, like being around her?

SMITH: Well, I thought she was a pretty strict person. [Laughing] C.M.: That’s what I’ve heard.

SMITH: Yeah. No way, she’s not still living is she?

C.M.: No, she passed, she was a hundred and two when she died, and that was in ninety-three, I think.

SMITH: Was it, well?

C.M.: Yeah, ninety-three or ninety-four.

SMITH: I just heard about it at the dinner. That was just a few years back.

C.M.: Yeah, she was a hundred and two, I think. Pretty sure. She lived to be pretty old. Well, now I guess one thing that is interesting, I’ve talked to people that lived at the settlement school, but like you lived in town pretty much, didn’t you? Right there real close. What was town like then? Of course, it is totally different now. But what was the town like itself, Hindman? Maybe things that you remember.

SMITH: Well, 16:00I remember....We lived, we moved, what date it was, I don’t remember, from the place down there near the forks. We moved up the left fork and across the Troublesome Creek on the left side. And another family that lived there was the D.W. Wallen family. And they lived across from the road at that time. And of course, we walked and went to the school, but it wasn’t far. As long as we lived there, you know, until we finished school. 17:00I don’t remember, my father worked most of his time, he taught some. Incidentally, he came from Breathitt County. And I think went to school, you’ve heard of Professor Clark’s school. He went to school there. And I guess, well he went to work for the Bank of Hindman and stayed there. He had tuberculosis and he was so careful about his condition, he had him a room over. His room was located in the house that we then lived in. At one end of the house, well the back 18:00of his room was the kitchen and so forth. Go into his room, where he usually took his meals, was down a porch, I mean there wasn’t any entrance into any of the other rooms, except from the porch, on the outside. And he took his meals in there and all that. Spent most of the time from his children, from us children. And he was very, very careful to guard against spreading what he had. And he, in his late years, he only lived to be sixty, I believe. And after working at the Bank of Hindman there for years and years, he went out West himself. He went to, he died in Arizona. My brother Bill went out there and 19:00got the body and returned it to Knott County. None of the other children, as far as I know, ever had that problem.

C.M.: He must have been real careful, like you said.

SMITH: Oh, he was, he was.

C.M.: Were there any places like downtown that you remember going to a lot? Maybe like stores that were popular?

SMITH: Well, I can remember there was one of the owners back at the time....well, I thought of the last name, I had it a moment ago. Part owner, I guess of a building there that was a mercantile place, out by the bridge, 20:00one side of the bridge. And then someone had a barber shop there, I remember a little something about. I remember something about the barber. Whenever you’d go into his place of business, he’d say....and enter his place, he’d say, have a sit down with him. [Laughing] Whether anybody wanted any work done or not, why that is what he would say to them, you know. And we had a barber at that time by the name of Vergie Hicks, and he’s long been deceased. I hear now, that they are going to try to change things around. How in the world 21:00could they change, make the front, because of the Troublesome Creek, below the, the way it runs together in front of the settlement or just above most of the settlement property. There is, to my memory there is no space left between the back of the bank and the buildings in line with it, to make a passage, a road.

C.M.: Yeah, I don’t know exactly how it is going to work either. I’m not for sure on that.

SMITH: I just, it doesn’t seem to me to be practical at all to change the place that is that part of Hindman.

C.M.: Well now, talking a little bit about going to school there. 22:00You mentioned a couple of people that you remembered and things. One thing we’re trying to find out about, is what the settlement school was like. And of course, it is different from your perspective, because you didn’t live there. You went to school there. I guess maybe, what kind of education do you feel that you got?

SMITH: Well, I think that it was considered pretty good, among the best.

C.M.: And I’m sure you had teachers, quite a few teachers from New England and things? What did you think about those ladies?

SMITH: Well, I thought they were all marvelous people, teachers, not having known them very much, except just in the classroom, you know.

C.M.: Right. I guess growing up in Hindman, what were 23:00some things that you all did, maybe for fun? If you were out with your buddies, what’s something you would do?

SMITH: Well, in school we played basketball.

C.M.: You did? Okay I didn’t know that.

SMITH: On an outside court. I think I mentioned something about that, a basketball court, an outside basketball court and then a tennis court below it. Jethro Amburgey, who was Manual Training teacher, I believe, he was the coach too. And over at Carr Creek, they had a basketball team over there.

C.M.: Right.

SMITH: And we went to Carr Creek and they came to Hindman to play, you know. And maybe a couple of games a year. 24:00It wasn’t like going out in the state, you know. Travel was all together different back then. But I guess we had a lot of fun with it, as much as they did anywhere else with better facilities and all.

C.M.: Yeah, I know, I’ve talked to several, you know, I’ve talked to people that graduated in your years, all the way up into the fifties. And everybody always mentions basketball and how that was the big thing to go to. It was very popular.

SMITH: It was, it was, yes.

C.M.: That’s interesting.

SMITH: And I think there was some outstanding players raised in Hindman and Carr Creek too. They went on to other places and played. 25:00I tried to play in high school, when I was still in Hindman, but when I went to college, I knew I couldn’t compete, you know. [Laughing] C.M.: Were there other things that you all did to, I guess to have fun? Did you spend much time up in the hills or anything?

SMITH: Oh yeah, yeah, we were supposed to be hunting, you know. I don’t guess we ever got any game or anything. [Laughter] We’d spend some time in the woods, you know. Then likely get poison ivy. I’ve had it many times. I have seen people with it on their face, their face would be swollen, you know. Poison ivy.

C.M.: I know, that would be awful. That would be terrible. 26:00Well, another thing that I’ve been asking people about is, people that went to school at the settlement of course, is about the emphasis on, like cultural things, like weaving and folk dancing and songs and things. Do you remember things like that? Was that very important when you were in school?

SMITH: Not much, I knew that there was some of that going on in the school, you know, teaching that sort of thing.

C.M.: I guess thinking back on it now, you said after you graduated of course, you went on to Eastern and then to Law school, before you went to fight in the war. But thinking back on it now, what kind of impact do you think, what kind of impact do you think going to the settlement school had on you? 27:00SMITH: Well, I guess really, since I was born over there on that property, and incidentally we have what we call a family reunion once a year. And we meet at the Hindman Settlement School, the May Stone Building, I believe it is. We have the last two or three years. We had one cousin that came from Florida. And last year we had, well, they’re pretty well all over, you know. Bakers and Smiths, they were pretty big families ordinarily. Seems like they had more children back then, 28:00than what they do now, what people do now.

C.M.: Another question I had was, you were telling me about going off to war, and it seems like I guess probably a lot of young men were drafted or went to war, that lived there in Hindman or were from that area. I guess what kind of effect did that have on Hindman, you know having so many people go off?

SMITH: Well, I really don’t know. Of course, I was in the service, I guess about three years and a half, or three years, three months and a half, from the time I was inducted until discharge. 29:00They really took, the shipment that I went out with, really took the most, I guess, at any one time from that area, from Hindman, Knott County.

C.M.: Are there things that maybe you remember about the settlement school that I haven’t asked you about maybe, that you think would be important? Or maybe just something you’ve remembered while we’ve been talking? Some people have certain funny stories that they think of that happened to them when they were in school. You know, just anything like that, if there’s anything that you feel like would be good.

SMITH: Well, I can’t think of anything specific. I’ve tried to, 30:00especially since you called.

C.M.: Right, yeah.

SMITH: And I understood that your folks were connected to the school?

C.M.: Yeah.

SMITH: I tried to think of things, that I might be asked about. [Laughing] My wife told me, said you won’t remember anything.

C.M.: Well, you remembered quite a bit.

END OF INTERVIEW