Oral History Interview with Amos Nickles

CASSIE MULLINS: I'm going to go ahead and tum this on. Just to get started. If you don't care, state your name.

AMOS NICKLES: My name is Amos Nickles.

C.M.: What years did you go up to the settlement school, or go to school up there?

NICKLES: I'd have to count back. I never did go to the settlement school. I went to, it was Knott County school then.

C.M.: Right.

NICKLES: Carl Smith was the principal when I went to school up there. Oh, did I mess up something?

C.M.: No, I was making sure it was on. It's on. And 1:00what year did you graduate from high school?

NICKLES: In thirty-seven, I guess.

C.M.: Yeah, I think that's right. We have this big list of everybody.

NICKLES: I think that's correct, thirty-seven.

C.M.: Now, were you the only one in your family that went to school up there?

NICKLES: Yes, the only one. I was the baby of the family and I was the only one that went to school there.

C.M.: Now, how did you hear about going to school over there? Or did you just.. . .I know some people went to local schools, one room schools and then found out about that.

NICKLES: As I say, I never did stay at the settlement school, honey. I always .... the first year I commuted from home. And 2:00then the other two years, I lived with Calloway Napier, who ran a boarding house up there. And I worked for him, worked my way on next two, three years up there. Stayed with him. I never, as such, stayed at the settlement school any.

C.M.: Now, when you were going to school there, because I know that.. . .like when I say going to settlement school, I guess I should explain that. I'm just talking about going to school there, because they were kind of together where they provided the teachers.

NICKLES: Yeah, they were. I guess most of teachers, at least some of them. Miss Standish and some of the others were settlement school teachers. I don't know what the arrangement was at that 3:00time between the county and the settlement. There was a close working relationship between them. They really had some dedicated teachers, I think, there. Eda Kay Smith is another one that I remember of the older ones. Miss Standish was a very, very, much dedicated lady. I got to know her real well. Eda Kay was the kind of teacher, she was really business like. And several of the boys that went to school at that time, were just like any time. They were a little bit rough. And they didn't like her much, because she was firm and wanted them to get an education. But she and I always got along real good. I never had any problems with her whatsoever. But 4:00she intended for you to be disciplined when you went to school, while you were in her room.

C.M.: Now which teacher was that?

NICKLES: Eda Kay Smith. She's the local lady that lived down at the mouth of ( ), right around Troublesome Creek, her family did.

C.M.: Who were some other teachers that you remember? That kind of stick out in your mind. That's one thing we are trying to find out about, the kind of teachers they had.

NICKLES: I took typing under James Still.

C.M.: What was that like?

NICKLES: That was wonderful. He was real good. He and I became friends too, in a real way. I don't know where it happened. First year.. .. l came. When I came back 5:00to Napier's for lunch, then I'd pick up his mail and take it to him. For, I know the last two years, maybe all three years. He and I became real friends. He'd come down there home on Big Branch. I lived on Big Branch then. He came down there many weekends and visited with us. I remember [Laughing] of course, most of us mountain folks have our own slang, you know. Every time I used a word, why I'd see him write it down. I knew what he was doing. He was picking up on it. But he was a real good friend of ours. And then one time he had a lot of books that he was .... I guess some of them he was discarding, that had run out of date or what not. But he gave me a whole wagon load of books. And I built 6:00myself a little house down there and had them .... save them. In fact, I still have some of them upstairs yet, that he gave me. Many of them were real good books. That's about it, as far as I know, honey, on that.

C.M.: Did you ever have Miss Cobb?

NICKLES: I never did have her. I knew her, but I never did have any classes under her.

C.M.: I guess one question I've had, that I've been interested in .... This would have been I guess during the Depression, wouldn't it? These years. Or directly after it.

NICKLES: After it. It was still in depression at that time. It was, the worst of it was just about over with at that time.

C.M.: How did that, I guess how did that affect your family?

NICKLES: Well, just about like everybody else's. We just about had to raise 7:00what you eat, except coffee and sugar and stuff like that, that you bought. Flour. We all had to work at home. Everybody pitched in to survive, is about what it added up to. None of my family had a regular job at that time. They'd just pick up a little work in the summertime, just temporary employment. It made it pretty rough on us, as such.

C.M.: I guess that made it rough for some people to go to school.

NICKLES: Yeah, of course one thing about it back then, most everybody was about on the same level. Nobody felt above anybody else. And everybody got along real well, because you recognized it was hard times and everybody accepted 8:00it as such. Of course, that was like me. I never would have been able to go to college, if there hadn't been a school like Berea. Where you could more or less, work your way through it. And I remember people were so good to me, as I look back on it. We had a man, who worked for Inland Gas Company. And even though I was just in high school, during the summer months he would give me all the work he could. He put me out even bossing road building. And I didn't even know what those things were. Also, our county agent, he was real good to me. And of course, I worked with 4-H clubs in Knott County. I don't mean to brag or anything, but 9:00I guess it was before I went to high school. Yeah, it was eighth grade this time. We had a three-man team, a judging team that went from Knott County and we won the State that year.

C.M.: And what did you win it in?

NICKLES: At UK, down at the fair, judging poultry.

C.M.: That's pretty good.

NICKLES: We were very fortunate, very fortunate.

C.M.: That is something.

NICKLES: All of us three fellows did real well. That was preparation for high school, I guess.

C.M.: Now, I've been talking to some people about the different classes and things you took. I mean I understand you took pretty much the basic classes, 10:00that any high school person would take. But one thing that was interesting was the Manual Training class. Tell me a little bit about that.

NICKLES: Oh yeah. Jethro Amburgey was the teacher at the time. I'm sorry to say, but I was never very crafty with my hands. And I didn't do, I made a good grade all right in it. But I seemed to be never accurate enough to catch on to it just the way I should. I still have some, a couple of pieces of furniture that I made while I was working there. I enjoyed it. He was a good Manual Training teacher. He helped you any way he could.

C.M.: What sorts of things did you all learn in that class?

NICKLES: It was just mostly carpentry, is all. We had some furniture building classes, in other words. I built a table and a medicine 11:00cabinet, and a few little things like that. But it was just small items that we could finish in there. Of course, along with that was a certain amount of training on carpentry, but not like you get in today's classes. At least I don't remember too much about other parts of it, other than the cabinet making and things like that. Just learned the use of tools, carpentry tools mostly.

C.M.: What kind of person was Jethro Amburgey? What do you remember about him?

NICKLES: He was a real nice person. I guess you wouldn't find a better person, than he was. He was a good teacher, too. He was easy going and well trained for his job, I imagine. Everybody 12:00thought a whole lot of him. If I remember correctly, he later became Superintendent, in other words, in charge of the Knott County school system, later on after I graduated. Just for a short, for maybe one term.

C.M.: Are there any other classes, maybe like classes you enjoyed particularly when you were in high school, that you remember?

NICKLES: No, not in particular. I was just very fortunate to make good grades in all of them. I was on the honor roll, just about, I guess, all the time. Maybe one time I didn't quite make it. I was very fortunate. I had to work hard though. I wasn't gifted. Of 13:00course, I had to work. I'd get up at four o'clock in the morning and build fires and things where I stayed. Then I'd stay up at night and finish the work. I didn't have much time for fun. Which is good, really. But I enjoyed it very much.

C.M.: How did you get so motivated to work that hard in school? What made you want to do that? Was it something your parents did?

NICKLES: No, no, no. At first, I wasn't that motivated, but I just decided you might as well put your best in whatever you're doing. And that's what I did, the best I could. I 14:00was valedictorian of the high school at graduation. Of course, we had a small class, it doesn't speak much. Just one of those things. I enjoyed high school days very much.

C.M.: Now, where did you grow up? You told me that a second ago. Where did you grow up?

NICKLES: Big Branch of Troublesome, just across the hill, down, three miles below Hindman.

C.M.: So, when you were living at home, how did you get to school?

NICKLES: Walked. Well, we had to walk about a mile and a half before we caught the bus. Sometimes we missed it and then we'd run. [Laughter] the first year. That's one reason why I decided to try to get a place closer to school. It made it kind of rough. We didn't have a road then, 15:00just a little run around. Just a little walk path around the hill. There was no roadway for a vehicle. No vehicles at that time, except wagons to get in and out of the area. We went right up the Branch way. If the water was up, you couldn't get through then. We had to add a walking bridge down there, so we could always have a crossing to get to school. We were lucky not to miss the bus too many times, but there were a few times that we did miss it. I had a couple of nephews and a niece that stayed at our house and went to school that year when I did. The three of us, we all went together. That's 16:00the reason I say we, whenever I think about missing the bus.

C.M.: Well, what did you ... .l know that people who lived in the settlement, ate lunch there.

What did you do each day for things like that?

NICKLES: Well, on the first year, of course, I took my lunch. And we'd come down to town. And Benton Newlin had a grocery store down there, grocery, hardware and whatnot, big store. We'd come down and eat in his store, most of us would. Of course, when I was living with the Napiers, I came down there for my lunch. We just packed our lunch and ate there, first year.

C.M.: Do you remember how long the typical school day was? What time you all started and finished?

NICKLES: The same 17:00( ). Pretty sure it was.

C.M.: I guess, did you have like six classes a day?

NICKLES: No, I don't believe we did. I just can't remember right offhand, honey, on that, how many. We had to have either five or six, five I believe.

C.M.: Yeah, some schools still do that, I think, five or six. I wasn't sure what it was like? Were you ever around Miss Watts much?

NICKLES: Not a whole lot, no. As I say, except for Miss Standish and Carter. They were two teachers 18:00that I had. They were from the settlement. That was my biggest connection with the settlement, other than the children that I went to school with. Of course, I knew Miss Watts, but I really didn't know her personally. I just knew her when I saw her.

C.M.: Well, since you didn't live over there, could you just go and visit with your friends?

NICKLES: Oh yeah.

C.M.: And things like that?

NICKLES: Uh hmm. Of course, they, all of them had their work schedules. As I say, it was a good working relationship. Having that school has been a real, real help to a lot of people. They wouldn't have been able to get an education, if it hadn't been for that one and other schools like them, of course.

C.M.: Right.

NICKLES: It's 19:00been a real asset to Knott County.

C.M.: What was people's attitude towards these women, just from being in this community .... them coming in?

NICKLES: They were just accepted as people here. They were no different really. And as far as I know, there was never any friction. They were accepted for who they were and the job they were doing. I never heard of any friction in any way. There could have been it, but I didn't know about it, is why I say it like that. Because all of them were real nice, dedicated people.

C.M.: Yeah, that's what a lot of people have said.

NICKLES: Oh yeah, they had to be to come in here and live like they did and fool wit people like us. 20:00[Laughter] They had to be and they were. They were, no doubt about it. And Miss Cobb was a sweet, old soul. As I say, I never had any classes under her. I can always remember that smile she had, talking to you, a real sweet personality.

C.M.: What kind of things did you all do like, just trying to figure out what it was like being .. .. you said you didn't have .... you worked most of the time you went to school. Did you ever have time to do anything extra, like maybe things you all did for fun?

NICKLES: No, as I say, where I worked in the lodgings, when I was there. The first year, of course, why I didn't have, my time was spent going to and from school. Occasionally, 21:00you know how young people are, they like to, there was a place or two in town where they had juke boxes and things like that. That was about the extent of our social life back then. There wasn't too much going on.

C.M.: Was basketball pretty popular back then too?

NICKLES: Well, it probably was, I just never was interested in it too much. The only basketball I ever played was mostly just on Sundays. When you lived in the country, why we'd get down there at the schoolhouse, a bunch of us. And play ball all day long. That was just about it, the extent of it, playing 22:00basketball. I like it as a sport today. We like it very much. Back then I wasn't interested. And I probably couldn't have been team material anyway, due to size and other things.

C.M.: I know some people that lived here in the community would sometimes work over on campus and do things. Did you ever do that in the summer or do anything like that?

NICKLES: No, no. To my knowledge, I don't remember any, sure don't.

C.M.: Another thing that I thought was interesting that people talked about. I was asking some about activities and things they did. And one thing that somebody brought up, was 23:00that Christmas was a pretty big deal. Did you all have a Christmas program?

NICKLES: You mean school wide?

C.M.: Yeah. Was there anything they did for that?

NICKLES: Not special I don't think. Of course, in grade school we always had a school program. And there were gifts sent, from both Caney and from the Hindman Settlement School too. Which helped out a lot of people that couldn't get things, even clothing. They were very fortunate. It was a big help in that way.

C.M.: I guess the one important question, just in your opinion, what kind of impact do you think the settlement school has had on this area?

NICKLES: I don't know that you could really 24:00put a price tag on it, honey. It's been so, it's helped so many people in so many different ways. It's just been wonderful really. One of the things that has helped to make Knott county what it is, and that's not much, now. But without it, I don't know what it would have been to tell you the truth about it. Because it's been so, such a big help in so many different facets of life. And it has.

C.M.: I mean, I know one important factor, of course, would just be education. What else do you think would be so important?

NICKLES: Well, I think also from a social standpoint, standards and things like that, it's helped a lot too. It's mainly educational, really. It 25:00just, as I say, I don't know that a price tag could be put on that.

C.M.: Right. I don't think so either.

NICKLES: No, there's no way, because there's so many lives that have been touched by it and helped by it. I was not, as I say, I was not.. .. didn't happen to be one of the ones that really got much out of it, other than just the teachers and the schools and the high school that is. It has been a wonderful help to a lot of people. Having a place to stay and go to school, you know, it meant a whole lot to people. Commuting back then was bad, mostly horseback and that made it kind of rough. In the early beginning, I mean, especially, it's 26:00been a real asset.

C.M.: I guess, do you keep in touch with the stuff that goes on now much?

NICKLES: Not a whole lot, not a whole lot. No, I don't. I get newsletters and things like that about it. I don't.. . .l ‘m just not very sociable in that way. I don't like crowds. I'm kind of withdrawn, I guess you could say. My wife's the same way. We just don't feel comfortable with everybody, so we just.. ..

C.M.: Was there, I mean, I've just been sitting here asking you questions, but.. 27:00 ..

NICKLES: That's all right.

C.M.: Is there anything else you feel would be important to maybe talk about or something you thought about while we've been talking? I just always like to ask people. Sometimes they say, why yeah I was just thinking about...

NICKLES: No, nothing in particular, honey, not that I can think of. I guess if I could take time, I might be able to think of it, but right now. Not too many things or instances that I can remember right off hand. I do appreciate you coming over and talking to me though.

C.M.: Yes.

END OF INTERVIEW