Oral History Interview Vivian Hyatt

Teka: Today is May 27, 1984. My name is Teka Ward.

Teka: I’m interviewing Vivian Hyatt. We’re at 503 Southland Blvd, Louisville, KY. Our topic is Lou Tate and the Little Loomhouse.

As we begin, Mrs. Hyatt, please tell me something about you.

Vivian: Well, I am a retiree. I worked at Porcelain Metals for 23 years, in the brushing department; enamel department. And then I worked with the Jewish Hospital several years ago, in different, smaller jobs. And I am a weaver.

Teka: And you have children of your own.

Vivian: I had four children of my own. I have three living children and one daughter who has passed on.

Teka: And you have grandchildren.

Vivian: I have four grandchildren and three great-grandchildren.

Teka: Tell me how you first came to know Lou Tate.

Vivian: Well, when I first moved to Louisville I went to the Wesley House. The ladies were weaving and then some of them would leave during the afternoon and go out to Lou Tate’s. They were talking about Lou Tate, you know. And I wondered about, you know, out there. They took a small loom and they rode the street car out there. And they talked about walking up this long hill. And they talked about Lou Tate, and everything.

And so then a few years after that I noticed in the paper one morning that Lou Tate, at the Little Loomhouse, was having an Open House; visitors were welcome. And I thought, well, I believe I’m going to take a chance on finding it. And so I got on this streetcar there at twenty-second and Oak and rode, then transferred onto Third Street. And so when I got on the streetcar then, everybody was going to the Loomhouse. They were talking about it. And I thought “O-o-oh, I don’t have no problem about how to find the top of the hill.” So then I made friends with them on the way and so I was never a stranger at the Little Loomhouse anymore.

So when we arrived, why, here came Lou Tate out, “Hello there, how’s everybody?”

And we went up to the top house. There were three houses: there was Little Loomhouse; that was where she lived, and then there was what she called Wisteria, the middle house, and then the top house was where we did the weaving.

Teka: What were you doing at Wesley House?

Vivian: Well, we were weaving rugs; rag rugs. They had these old time looms, great big ones and everybody was weaving a rug.

Teka: Were you teaching people?

Vivian: No, I was just going there then.

Teka: Oh, to take lessons?

Vivian: Yes, to take lessons. It was a craft place, you know. Everybody went in the morning. And then later on I took ceramics at night. Then I worked with those. And I helped Miss McNell after I went a while, you know, after the children got larger, well then…

Teka: When you went to see Lou Tate, you already had experience with weaving.

Vivian: I had just woven a rug, that was all.

Teka: So you went up there that first day…

Vivian: I went up there that first day; Agnes Scott was the lady that was going to teach the workshop. It was two dollars and so then I went ahead and she showed me how. I sat down at the loom just like the rest of them and did the technique which I still know how to do.

Teka: What can you tell us about the technique?

Vivian: It was tapestry interlock. She had came from Germany several years ago. She was a Swedish weaver. And she worked at …one of those hospitals…, Our Lady of Peace. She taught crafts there. But this was on a Saturday and so she came and gave a workshop.

Teka: Was Lou Tate also walking around during all this?

Vivian: She was there, yes, but she didn’t do any weaving or anything. She just was visiting and welcoming everybody. And then when time came for lunch she got in her station wagon and went out and bought bologna and bread and we each chipped in and gave so much and that was the lunch.

Teka: So you spent the whole day there.

Vivian: It was all day, uh huh.

Teka: And you were weaving what, a tapestry?

Vivian: It was tapestry, yes. She was just teaching the technique, you see.

And then she had a photographer there who took all of our pictures. So I am in one of those pages at the Loomhouse.

Teka: So the next time that you went to the Loomhouse…

Vivian: Well, it was another Open House she had and she had Nell Peterson from the Art Center and she was going to teach a class with color. And so she had different pieces of paper, you know, and matched them up--what colors went together, and what would, you know, about weaving, what colors--how to put color in weaving. It was a little bit different from others, see, cause the threads, you know, run across it and every thing and so it’s how to put the dark and light color and how it changes, you know, and gives it a different appearance..

Teka: Was this your first experience with weaving then before…?

Vivian: We didn’t weave any. She just demonstrated the color. She had some pieces of weaving, and, you know, how it would use color in the weaving.

Teka: Had you read about it in the paper? Is that how you knew?

Vivian: That was how I went again.

Teka: And what about the next time you went, for instance?

Vivian: Well, a lady from Wisconsin was visiting and then I went one night after work, and this lady was there and she had brought several pieces of her weaving, but what impressed me was the skirt.

She had on a skirt that she had woven little telephones in all the way around it Her husband was a telephone man and she had woven those in. That was laid in. That’s the technique you call, ‘laid in.’

And she had several beautiful pieces then.

Teka: And she spoke to you all about…?

Vivian: Yes, she talked to all of us and explained her pieces. Of course, it didn’t mean anything to me cause I wasn’t a weaver at that time. I just enjoyed them. That’s what, you know, inspiration that inspired me to take the weaving later on then.

So it was quite a while then that she had a piece in the paper again about going to have new classes opened up .And then is when I went and signed up for the classes. That was in the wintertime and so she didn’t heat the top house at that time so she had us down in her cabin then.

Teka: And so you were able to learn how to weave right down in the cabin where she lived.

Vivian: In the cabin where she lived. She put things back over in one corner then.

So then she had a class at Nazareth College, they called it. Now it is Spalding. And I went with her up there, because I didn’t get too much out there, because the others were more advanced than I was. I was a beginner and, of course, they got the attention mostly. So she told me then I could go with her up there, which I did.

Teka: And you and she would travel over there together, you mean? Or you would…?

Vivian: Yes, un huh.

Teka: Did she come by and pick you up?

Vivian: No. No, I went up on the bus and then there were a couple of colored ladies from the west end; teachers, they came back down Oak Street and I came home with them. But I went to Tate’s after work and helped her load the looms up and everything to take. She had a station wagon and she filled that full of looms, you see, and she took them backwards and forth for them to weave on, for the class. It was every night; I think it was

five nights. It was the Sisters; they took weaving, too, there at the college, and then others. We had a whole class of them.

Teka: So you helped her but you also learned how to weave?

Vivian: I learned how to weave and then after class was over, then I had a ride home. A couple of the students went my way and so I rode home with them. And, of course, Tate went on home-- We’d help her load the stuff back up and she went on back up to her home.

Teka: What is the next thing you remember after that, in terms of your history with weaving, that you did?

Vivian: Well, then she invited me to join the Kentucky Weavers.

Teka: Tell me what the Kentucky Weavers is.

Vivian: Well, she told me it was an organization that we paid five dollars for a year, I believe it was, and then we could come out and weave on her looms. But we had to help, you know, thread up the looms and do a little housekeeping, and things like that. And then we could go out on our spare time. ‘Cause I was working then and it would be mostly over the weekends that I would go out. And then when we went, we were stopped down at the well. She had a cistern, I guess it was, and we were to draw some water and take it up to the top of the hill because she had a commode in a little room at the back of that and it wasn’t connected to a sewer or anything. So we’d carry the water up to flush the toilet.

Teka: Oh, that was part of your going there.

Vivian: Yes. Each one was supposed to do that. Otherwise, she would of had to carry the water herself. But each one was supposed to help take care of that.

Teka: And there was a well down at the bottom of the property?

Vivian: It was a cistern I guess you’d call it, yes. We drew it up with a great big long--you know, old-time thing. You’d put it down and it’d sink, you know, and you brought it up and put it into the bucket.

Teka: Mostly you went on the weekends.

Vivian: It was on the weekends ‘cause I worked. I had a full time job, you see.

Teka: And would you get to weave when you were there on weekends? Did she have special classes?

Vivian: No, it was just weavers who’d come in and weave. A lot of times we wove for the house, (Teka: for the Loomhouse?) for the Loomhouse, because she used to sell pieces, you see. And then she had them for her--pieces she’d want worked out, somebody to do, you know, and help thread up looms for her, because she gave workshops and she needed somebody to thread the looms and have them ready for travel.

Teka: About how many people were members of the Kentucky Weavers?

Vivian: Oh, that was a long group cause she had them all over the state, at that time.

And then she had a mailing. She mailed out a booklet once a month; pages of different patterns that she’d worked out; a lot of them helped her with it. And she printed them up herself then.

Teka: Yes, I was going to ask you about those pages; the publications that she…

Vivian: There was about a dozen in each month.

Teka: What did she call that? What was the name of that? I can’t remember…

Vivian: Pages is all ever I heard them called because they were loose, you see.

Teka: She had a mailing list.

Vivian: She had a mailing list that she mailed them to different ones, whoever the subscribers were, they were supposed to receive a mailing once a month

Teka: So she wrote this up and typed it and then got it copied.

Vivian: She had a mimeograph machine or something down at her house. I never saw that now. It wasn’t long after I went there till she did away with that thing and she started having printers to do the pages for her.

Teka: And she started having publications that were bound.

Vivian: Yes, she did have some of those. Weaving is Fun; that was one that’s bound. And Country something…

Teka: Did you all ever do any of the…? When you did the weaving…you would experiment with some of the weaving directions, I assume.

Vivian: Yes, ‘cause she mailed out the samples that went with some of these pages and, see, that’s what we did; helped to do those samples and she’d cut the pieces up, you see, and would staple them onto the page for other weavers. Well, she sent them all over the world at that time.

Teka: Do you remember when she started the Kentucky Weavers, Jr., for instance? I’ve heard of that. Kentucky Weavers, Jr. for the young people.

Vivian: Well, now that was going on when I went there ‘cause I helped her with the scouts.

Teka: Oh, you did. Would they come on Saturdays?

Vivian: After school. After school.

Teka: And she would train them in weaving.

Vivian: Yes, the Scout leader would bring a group of--say, twenty or thirty at a time. That’s a group of them, you see. Then she’d let so many weave and then they’d step aside and then the next group would weave.

Teka: And then everybody would get a turn.

Vivian: Everybody got their turn.

And then later on we’d go out there on Sunday afternoons or the weekend and the big group of kids always liked to gather those fossils. I used to take them up that path to the top of the hill where that old quarry was and they would pick up those fossils, you know. So they enjoyed doing those.

Teka: Did you help with the Open Houses?

Vivian: Yes, I helped with the Open Houses most of the time. I usually took the guests around and showed them the weaving and told them about the weaving and the coverlets and things like that. And then if she had little pieces for sale, you know, that I would let them buy them, and then put the money in her pocket. She usually had a pocket that I’d slip the money in and told her what I’d sold.

Teka: How long do you think you knew Lou Tate and went up to the Little Loomhouse?

Vivian: Well, from the beginning, I guess, it’s about thirty years that I went there but I didn’t go regularly until after I retired, then I spent quite a bit of time out there. Then I went with a group to different things. Now we went to the Fair one year.

Teka: You yourself have won awards at the State Fair, haven’t you, for you weaving?

Vivian: Yes. I won Sweepstake one year. Then I usually put in a few pieces every year. They help the Fair.

Teka: Was the first time you went out to the Fair with Lou Tate?

Vivian: No, I didn’t go when she was going, ‘cause Lou Tate used to be the judge and then every year the whole, all the Loomhouse members would put pieces in. They went out and wove pieces like little hot mats and things and then she sold them and they put the money in a kitty and that was for the prizes at the Fair.

Teka: When Lou Tate taught you all, you took weaving lessons directly from her. (Vivian: Yes, that‘s where I…) Did she have a special technique (Vivian: No.) of teaching you?

Vivian: Well, she started out with a two harness technique and then we did the lace weave and she had us to do an initial. And then she usually got you on a placemat or a bag or something that you could just go ahead and she wouldn’t have to bother with you. That’s usually what she aimed to do.

Teka: Did you get to keep those things or would you donate a lot of them to the Loomhouse to sell?

Vivian: Those first pieces were all in one big wall hanging. All the techniques that we learned from the lessons were in one piece. And we usually brought that home.

Later on she told us to bring our own thread and then we paid her for the warp and we could weave. And we were supposed to keep those.

But if we used her thread--you see, we wove pieces for the house. She liked for each weaver to weave some special piece for her collection. And that was hers, you see. Because when a visitor came she could show them different techniques, different patterns and had the name of different students that worked them out.

She had weaving everywhere because every time you went she had different weaving because she had traveling exhibits, you know. They swapped exhibits from all over the country. different countries She would send them an exhibit and, in exchange, they would send her one.

And so there was always something different to see in weaving every time that you went. So it was an inspiration just to go and look around. You know, she had people from everywhere, when they’d come to town on vacation, they’d always visit the Little Loomhouse before they went [back home].

She had Marlene Sellander(?) from Sweden, when she was touring the United States. Why then, she visited the Little Loomhouse and bought some pages and things from her. And then there’s Florence Acklee(?) from Canada who was a great friend of hers and she always came to the Little Loomhouse. She used to, years ago. And she’d have an extra cot and they stayed there at her house. They slept there, you see, and she stayed for about a week and exchanged ideas on weaving and everything.

And the different weaving books over the years; they always had an article by Lou Tate. She’d always contribute just something for the other weavers. And then before she died she made a visit to Canada to visit her friend, Mary Black, who is an outstanding weaver.

She kind of wanted me to go with her. She invited me to go with her. While she was in Canada she wrote me a letter and told me that she had three hundred new patterns. And when she came home she wanted me to help her to work them out. But she got home about the time I got the letter.

So she wrote me a letter then that they were going to have a party one afternoon out to the Loomhouse. This lady from Illinois, some doctor‘s wife, who worked with children in Illinois, said she was coming out to take some lessons or something from Tate. And she [Lou] wanted to have all of us to get together and to meet her in the afternoon. So I went out but when I got out there she was cleaning instead of having a party!

The lady was there. I did meet her though. And so then I went back in the middle house there and looked around and something was leaking. She [Lou] had gone down to rest, in her house, you know, to take a rest. And I said, “What’s leaking on this stuff?”

And so I gathered up all that stuff and scattered it all over the hillside, all those pieces of weaving and thread and everything. And so then when she woke up--I didn’t know she was up-- and so the lady came down the hill. She says, “What on earth is going on here?” And she stood there and said, “Well, I don’t know. Vivian did it; she didn’t ask me.” I thought, oh, I …

But she wasn’t mad about it at all. She kind of liked it, but she wanted me to put it back because she wanted me to take her to the library and to the grocery, you know, that night. So I took her then to the library and to the grocery. She got a whole lot of books. She forgot to take the books out and when I got home there were all those books, so I had to come out the next day then.

I called her and told her I had the books and I’d come out the next morning and bring them. I wasn’t going to make it back that night, ’cause there was so much traffic. There was something going on in Iroquois Park and there was too much traffic, and the race track, too. And she told me not to come back that morning, then ‘cause she was going to give this lady her lesson. So then I came back on Sunday afternoon, I believe it was. She wanted me to weave myself some pieces then. That was one of the patterns that she got from Canada and she wanted me to have that and she gave me the thread and everything and she says “Now you weave that amount for yourself.” And so I sat down then and wove by myself.

When I visited Tate at the hospital for the first time after she’d gone in, why she says to me, “I want you to get all of the weavers together and the lawyer when I get back home because I want to make a will because I want to leave the Little Loomhouse to the weavers.”

So then she got well and she came back home, but she kept saying that she wanted to get us all together. But I was waiting for Sue Kendrick to get back from Hawaii ‘cause I wanted her to have something to do with it. I really didn’t know who the weavers were. But anyway we never got back together.

Then after she went to the hospital, why then she told me again that we must get together, you know, and make out a will. But then she was losing time and everything, and so then one of the nurses called Ann ……(Hopper, Harper?) and so she called the Attorney then and he came in and he fixed out the will then like she wanted it. When I went back to visit her again she told me that she had fixed the will with everything she wanted done. And she says, “Now, Vivian, you know the children’s program is important to me. That’s known all over the world.” She said, “After I’m gone I want the children’s program to go on.” She said, “Do you have a little time today.” And I said, “Yes, ‘cause I’m not going to have to go home and I can stay with you.” So I stayed with her and talked with her for quite a while, but I was getting kind of tired and so when the nurse came to take a blood test, well then, I excused myself and went on home. Of course, she died a day or two after that.

So after she died then, Sue Kendrick called me one day and she said, “Vivian, I’ve been talking to the lawyer, and don’t you think…If you’ll go with me, we’ll go over to the Loomhouse and we’ll pick at a lot of that surplus stuff, and we’ll sell off some of those old books and things, you know, and kind of straighten the place up.” I told that her we would then, so we set a date that we’d go out and clean it up. She’d talked to the lawyer and told him at what terms that we would sell some of the stuff.

So we went out and we worked about three weeks, every day. It was real hot and sweat ran off our nose and everything. And so we were cleaning; she was cleaning the windows and I was cleaning out the shelves. And I turned around and knocked the bottle of Windex off and broke it all to pieces. Sue said, “Vivian, that makes me nervous, too. I’m going to move Lou Tate upstairs.” And I said, “Where’s she at?” And she said “Her ashes are in that vase.” So she went up and took it upstairs then. And oooh, I said, “Oooh, I don’t know if I would have come out here, if I had known that.” But we’ve been out here for three weeks and it doesn’t bother me now. So we went ahead and got it cleaned up and we took stuff that needed finishing and stuff to wash and pressed it nice and everything. And so we then set the date. Then we opened it up for about two weeks, I believe it was. And sold things off then. And then after that then we closed up.

I was invited to Col. Sanders birthday party. But we were working out at the Loomhouse and so I asked them if I could bring the Loomhouse? You know, that I would have them five weavers and five spinners? So they said OK, and they paid us twenty-five dollars, you see! So we went up there for the one day then and oh, we sold over two hundred dollars [worth], I believe it was, of things, you know. And got the twenty-five dollars then and that gave us a little nest egg to start with.

And then when the Fair came, why the lady invited me again. And then I invited Sue to go with me, just us two. But we went in the name of the Loomhouse, you know, and had the displays. She wove and I spun for ten days at the fair. Well, that gave us some more money, you see, to put into the fund. So we had a some money to get started. So then is when we organized. The lawyer took over then and we had the first board meeting and everything for the first year. So that was the beginning of the new organization of the Little Loomhouse. We really thought if we didn’t do that, probably it would never open again. That’s why we didn’t want to wait too long, you know, and so

that’s when it got started.

Then Sue and I, we started teaching then and we had Scouts. We had classes on Tuesday morning and Tuesday night and then Saturday morning. And then every day we had Scouts after school. We had Scouts running out of our ears, almost! So that was the beginning of the Lou Tate Foundation.

After she had died they took her over to the funeral home and they laid her out. Instead of flowers on the casket, they spread one of the coverlets, hearts and diamonds, on the casket. And then she didn’t want a funeral. She wanted to be cremated and her ashes spread on the hill. And so they cremated her then and put the ashes in the vase and then afterwards spread them over the grounds.

Teka: This is the end of side one, interview one, with Vivian Hyatt about Lou Tate and the Little Loomhouse.